Adamdrake Type Break In
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24072007, 12:43
Marky BMP
#1 Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Basingstoke Hants Posts: 8,761
Apex Models Team Driver
Heat cycle..........running an engine in
Thought it was about time we had a "Heat Cycle, How to run an engine in" thread, since alot of members are asking what does "heat cycle mean" I've copied and pasted this from another forum, as i think it's a very good explanation, and a great step by step guide.
Quote:
heat up case to about 210220 degrees before starting up for the first 7 tanks. wrapped head with industrial style paper towels i got from work. tank 1= idle on box, keeping it around 210225 degrees tank 2= same as above tank 3=same as above but this time off the box, just sitting on the deck surface tank 4= on the street with about 25% throttle control. temps got hot REALLY quick. but tamed it down to around 230 tank 5= same as above, but fattened up to run at 220 high tank 6= same as above with 50 % throttle control. temps holding great tank 7= unwrapped head. leaned out alot to get hotter temps tank 8= unwrapped head, ran at 75% throttle. tank 9 = start to race tune, but keeping it slightly on the rich side (HSN) Allow the engine to fully cool down between tanks, with the piston at BDC (bottom dead centre) As you can see, from the very first time you start the engine you need to get the temps over 200, this will reduce the amount of stress placed on the rod when it slams into the "pinch zone". This is a tried and tested method and should insure a long life from your engine. Remember to change airfilters on a regular bassis and keep the engine clean, an engine caked in mud and crud will just get hotter due to the mud acting like a blanket ;) Here's a (click here>)link with even more facts about why should get those temps in the 200's from the very first time you fire the engine up B)
Marky __________________
24072007, 12:48
minny Member
#2 Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Bolton! Posts: 732
the johnny cool guy version ENGINE BREAKIN LIKE THE PROS This was copied from a post by STEPHEN BESS on the "Starting Grid" message board as he tried to help another member get more life and performance out of his OS motor. This breakin method should apply to virtually any ABC hobby nitro engine (except for ringed engines). If you are still idling at least a tank through during breakin, you're using the oldschool accepted method (still works well for some!) but it's not the method that the top engine guys (Ron Paris, Dennis Richey, Rody Roem, Michael Salven are just a few I've spoken personally with about this) recommend anymore. From the very 1st time you start your engine, plop the car on the ground & begin running it in a parking lot in 23 minute intervals, tuned only *slightly rich* getting the temps up in the 200F range on a normal day. Every 23 minutes, shut the engine down & let it cool completely with the piston at BDC, and then fire it back up; continue this cycle until you've run 15 min or so, and then bump up to 3 4 minute intervals. Vary the RPM and don't be afraid to get the temps in the 200's. What you want is heat cycling of the components without the incredible stress that comes with breaking an engine in when it's overly rich & cold. After cycling the engine in this mannerfor about 2025 total minutes, it'll be ready for the track and race tuning. I realize this method goes against the oldschool "idle on the box" routine, but you'll be amazed once you've completed this breakin routine, your OS will still have amazing pinch w/out sticking at the top AND your OS's compression will last far longer than it will with the "old school" method. You say you run the engine at "factory settings" for the first FIVE tanks? That alone causes lots of stress, as the factory OS settings are very rich on every OS I've ever owned or tuned. The piston & sleeve haven't expanded to operating temps, and every time the engine turns over, the piston slams into the pinch zone at TDC. The notsosurprising result can be a cracked conrod at the crank pin that's where the majority of the stresses occur as the engine turns over. I've only heard of about 68 OS engines breaking conrods, and they're ALWAYS during the first gallon...and almost every time it's because the guys have performed the break in procedure you described. Doesn't seem like a mystery as to why it's happening. Drawing out the breakin routine really stresses the engine & actually wears away compression along the way. This method I've outlined will feel weird at every step, but after you try it once, you'll notice a big difference in your engine's performance & lifespan. Hope this helps; give this breakin method a shot you have nothing to gain except longer life & more power __________________
24072007, 12:50
Marky BMP
#3
Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Basingstoke Hants Posts: 8,761
Apex Models Team Driver
Quote:
Originally posted by minny@Jul 24 2007, 11:48 AM the johnny cool guy version ENGINE BREAKIN LIKE THE PROS This was copied from a post by STEPHEN BESS on the "Starting Grid" message board as he tried to help another member get more life and performance out of his OS motor. This breakin method should apply to virtually any ABC hobby nitro engine (except for ringed engines). If you are still idling at least a tank through during breakin, you're using the oldschool accepted method (still works well for some!) but it's not the method that the top engine guys (Ron Paris, Dennis Richey, Rody Roem, Michael Salven are just a few I've spoken personally with about this) recommend anymore. From the very 1st time you start your engine, plop the car on the ground & begin running it in a parking lot in 23 minute intervals, tuned only *slightly rich* getting the temps up in the 200F range on a normal day. Every 23 minutes, shut the engine down & let it cool completely with the piston at BDC, and then fire it back up; continue this cycle until you've run 15 min or so, and then bump up to 34 minute intervals. Vary the RPM and don't be afraid to get the temps in the 200's. What you want is heat cycling of the components without the incredible stress that comes with breaking an engine in when it's overly rich & cold. After cycling the engine in this mannerfor about 2025 total minutes, it'll be ready for the track and race tuning. I realize this method goes against the oldschool "idle on the box" routine, but you'll be amazed once you've completed this breakin routine, your OS will still have amazing pinch w/out sticking at the top AND your OS's compression will last far longer than it will with the "old school" method. You say you run the engine at "factory settings" for the first FIVE tanks? That alone causes lots of stress, as the factory OS
settings are very rich on every OS I've ever owned or tuned. The piston & sleeve haven't expanded to operating temps, and every time the engine turns over, the piston slams into the pinch zone at TDC. The notsosurprising result can be a cracked conrod at the crank pinthat's where the majority of the stresses occur as the engine turns over. I've only heard of about 68 OS engines breaking conrods, and they're ALWAYS during the first gallon...and almost every time it's because the guys have performed the breakin procedure you described. Doesn't seem like a mystery as to why it's happening. Drawing out the breakin routine really stresses the engine & actually wears away compression along the way. This method I've outlined will feel weird at every step, but after you try it once, you'll notice a big difference in your engine's performance & lifespan. Hope this helps; give this breakin method a shotyou have nothing to gain except longer life & more power
Link added in original post Was trying to find it
Marky __________________
24112007, 21:30
Marky BMP
#4 Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Basingstoke Hants Posts: 8,761
Apex Models Team Driver
Re: Heat cycle..........running an engine in
Adam Drakes method of heat cycling an engine, slightly different to the above methods, due to not hitting 200* on each tank, but still has the desired effect
__________________
09032008, 23:25
Technex
Numpty of the Month
#5 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: London Posts: 58
Re: Heat cycle..........running an engine in
Deleted Last edited by Technex : 24 082008 at 20:46.
05092008, 20:24
Beanie Active Member
#6 Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: New Haw, Surrey, UK Posts: 1,060
Re: Heat cycle..........running an engine in
The first method suggests keeping the engine at 200 deg. F for a whole tank, but the 'cool guy and drake methods seem to suggest that you get the engine up to roughly 200 and then immediately look to cool it back down by either stopping it, or richening a la Drake? Which is best? up to temp for a whole tank and let it sit at 200 until it runs out of fuel and then cool down or get it up to temp and then immediately shut off, cool down and then restart? __________________ Losi Muggy (Spek, Mach 427/SH.28, 48T Spur, Steering mod, ACE, Silver/White Shock springs, High Temp discs) Losi 8T (Spek, ACE's, Mach427) HPI RS4 EVO 3 BMW (Spek) Maverick Atom XB (Spek) For those long winter nights indoors!! www.ddgraphics.co.uk 05092008, 20:32
damstac Member
#7 Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Newcastle upon tyne Posts: 916
Re: Heat cycle..........running an engine in
I use the Jonny Cool method and it works great but does take a long time to do it properly. __________________ LOSI 8IGHT 2.0 ACE SERVO'S, RB C5bb,RB C6 L2G,PICCO P7R EVO2, CRT.5 SH .12, B44 NOSRAM MATRIX EVO,GM EVO 6.5,
05092008, 22:41
Beanie Active Member
#8 Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: New Haw, Surrey, UK Posts: 1,060
Re: Heat cycle..........running an engine in
Hmm....might combine both methods in a way. Wrap the head and get it up to 200 ASAP, then unwrap it and let it idle at 200 for 34 minutes and then shut it off. Cool down and then start again. Going to do this for 2 tanks and then do the same but this time on the ground using a little throttle and then shut off after 34 minutes. Couple of tanks like that and then maybe start to lean out the HSN a little... __________________ Losi Muggy (Spek, Mach 427/SH.28, 48T Spur, Steering mod, ACE, Silver/White Shock springs, High Temp discs) Losi 8T (Spek, ACE's, Mach427) HPI RS4 EVO 3 BMW (Spek) Maverick Atom XB (Spek) For those long winter nights indoors!! www.ddgraphics.co.uk 19012009, 21:45
Ross71 Member
#9
Join Date: May 2008 Location: Dunstable Posts: 323
Re: Heat cycle..........running an engine in
Quick question for those in the know, can i ask why on the 3rd tank i have to take the car of the starter box, or was this wrote on the 1st of April
Cheers Ross
heat up case to about 210220 degrees before starting up for the first 7 tanks. wrapped head with industrial style paper towels i got from work. tank 1= idle on box, keeping it around 210225 degrees tank 2= same as above tank 3=same as above but this time off the box, just sitting on the deck surface tank 4= on the street with about 25% throttle control. temps got hot REALLY quick. but tamed it down to around 230 tank 5= same as above, but fattened up to run at 220 high tank 6= same as above with 50 % throttle control. temps holding great tank 7= unwrapped head. leaned out alot to get hotter temps tank 8= unwrapped head, ran at 75% throttle. tank 9 = start to race tune, but keeping it slightly on the rich side (HSN) __________________ Muggy RB928,JP-3,Ace's,lots more for sale soon
Mugen MBX5-T. Caster K8-T Losi ? coming soon
19012009, 21:56
S3 NUTT Member
#10 Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: S.Wales Posts: 408
Re: Heat cycle..........running an engine in
Yes thats what i thought I just went with it __________________ XB 808 RB WS7111 ENGINE ACE SERVO'S 3GR 2.4 LOSI 8T RB S7 ACE,HITEC SERVO'S 'GWENT NITRO RACERS' Page 1 of 2 1 2 > « Previous Thread | Next Thread »
Posting Rules You may not post new threads You may not post replies You may not post attachments You may not edit your posts vB code is On Smilies are On [IMG] code is On HTML code is Off
Forum Jump Engine tech corner
Go
All times are GMT +1. The time now is 15:24. Contact Us MaxBashing Archive Top
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8 Copyright ©2000 2009, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. Stoney Castle Publushing Ltd
Home Review Forum Magazine Track Gallery Shop Events News Links
User Name
MaxBashing Online Forum > General RC Banter > Engine tech corner Heat cycle..........running an engine in Register
FAQ
Password Members List
User Name
c Remember Me? d e f g Log in
Calendar
Page 1 of 2 1 2 > Thread Tools Display Modes
24072007, 12:43
Marky BMP
#1 Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Basingstoke Hants Posts: 8,761
Apex Models Team Driver
Heat cycle..........running an engine in
Thought it was about time we had a "Heat Cycle, How to run an engine in" thread, since alot of members are asking what does "heat cycle mean" I've copied and pasted this from another forum, as i think it's a very good explanation, and a great step by step guide.
Quote:
heat up case to about 210220 degrees before starting up for the first 7 tanks. wrapped head with industrial style paper towels i got from work. tank 1= idle on box, keeping it around 210225 degrees tank 2= same as above tank 3=same as above but this time off the box, just sitting on the deck surface tank 4= on the street with about 25% throttle control. temps got hot REALLY quick. but tamed it down to around 230 tank 5= same as above, but fattened up to run at 220 high tank 6= same as above with 50 % throttle control. temps holding great tank 7= unwrapped head. leaned out alot to get hotter temps tank 8= unwrapped head, ran at 75% throttle. tank 9 = start to race tune, but keeping it slightly on the rich side (HSN) Allow the engine to fully cool down between tanks, with the piston at BDC (bottom dead centre) As you can see, from the very first time you start the engine you need to get the temps over 200, this will reduce the amount of stress placed on the rod when it slams into the "pinch zone". This is a tried and tested method and should insure a long life from your engine. Remember to change airfilters on a regular bassis and keep the engine clean, an engine caked in mud and crud will just get hotter due to the mud acting like a blanket ;) Here's a (click here>)link with even more facts about why should get those temps in the 200's from the very first time you fire the engine up B)
Marky __________________
24072007, 12:48
minny Member
#2 Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Bolton! Posts: 732
the johnny cool guy version ENGINE BREAKIN LIKE THE PROS This was copied from a post by STEPHEN BESS on the "Starting Grid" message board as he tried to help another member get more life and performance out of his OS motor. This breakin method should apply to virtually any ABC hobby nitro engine (except for ringed engines). If you are still idling at least a tank through during breakin, you're using the oldschool accepted method (still works well for some!) but it's not the method that the top engine guys (Ron Paris, Dennis Richey, Rody Roem, Michael Salven are just a few I've spoken personally with about this) recommend anymore. From the very 1st time you start your engine, plop the car on the ground & begin running it in a parking lot in 23 minute intervals, tuned only *slightly rich* getting the temps up in the 200F range on a normal day. Every 23 minutes, shut the engine down & let it cool completely with the piston at BDC, and then fire it back up; continue this cycle until you've run 15 min or so, and then bump up to 3 4 minute intervals. Vary the RPM and don't be afraid to get the temps in the 200's. What you want is heat cycling of the components without the incredible stress that comes with breaking an engine in when it's overly rich & cold. After cycling the engine in this mannerfor about 2025 total minutes, it'll be ready for the track and race tuning. I realize this method goes against the oldschool "idle on the box" routine, but you'll be amazed once you've completed this breakin routine, your OS will still have amazing pinch w/out sticking at the top AND your OS's compression will last far longer than it will with the "old school" method. You say you run the engine at "factory settings" for the first FIVE tanks? That alone causes lots of stress, as the factory OS settings are very rich on every OS I've ever owned or tuned. The piston & sleeve haven't expanded to operating temps, and every time the engine turns over, the piston slams into the pinch zone at TDC. The notsosurprising result can be a cracked conrod at the crank pin that's where the majority of the stresses occur as the engine turns over. I've only heard of about 68 OS engines breaking conrods, and they're ALWAYS during the first gallon...and almost every time it's because the guys have performed the break in procedure you described. Doesn't seem like a mystery as to why it's happening. Drawing out the breakin routine really stresses the engine & actually wears away compression along the way. This method I've outlined will feel weird at every step, but after you try it once, you'll notice a big difference in your engine's performance & lifespan. Hope this helps; give this breakin method a shot you have nothing to gain except longer life & more power __________________
24072007, 12:50
Marky BMP
#3
Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Basingstoke Hants Posts: 8,761
Apex Models Team Driver
Quote:
Originally posted by minny@Jul 24 2007, 11:48 AM the johnny cool guy version ENGINE BREAKIN LIKE THE PROS This was copied from a post by STEPHEN BESS on the "Starting Grid" message board as he tried to help another member get more life and performance out of his OS motor. This breakin method should apply to virtually any ABC hobby nitro engine (except for ringed engines). If you are still idling at least a tank through during breakin, you're using the oldschool accepted method (still works well for some!) but it's not the method that the top engine guys (Ron Paris, Dennis Richey, Rody Roem, Michael Salven are just a few I've spoken personally with about this) recommend anymore. From the very 1st time you start your engine, plop the car on the ground & begin running it in a parking lot in 23 minute intervals, tuned only *slightly rich* getting the temps up in the 200F range on a normal day. Every 23 minutes, shut the engine down & let it cool completely with the piston at BDC, and then fire it back up; continue this cycle until you've run 15 min or so, and then bump up to 34 minute intervals. Vary the RPM and don't be afraid to get the temps in the 200's. What you want is heat cycling of the components without the incredible stress that comes with breaking an engine in when it's overly rich & cold. After cycling the engine in this mannerfor about 2025 total minutes, it'll be ready for the track and race tuning. I realize this method goes against the oldschool "idle on the box" routine, but you'll be amazed once you've completed this breakin routine, your OS will still have amazing pinch w/out sticking at the top AND your OS's compression will last far longer than it will with the "old school" method. You say you run the engine at "factory settings" for the first FIVE tanks? That alone causes lots of stress, as the factory OS
settings are very rich on every OS I've ever owned or tuned. The piston & sleeve haven't expanded to operating temps, and every time the engine turns over, the piston slams into the pinch zone at TDC. The notsosurprising result can be a cracked conrod at the crank pinthat's where the majority of the stresses occur as the engine turns over. I've only heard of about 68 OS engines breaking conrods, and they're ALWAYS during the first gallon...and almost every time it's because the guys have performed the breakin procedure you described. Doesn't seem like a mystery as to why it's happening. Drawing out the breakin routine really stresses the engine & actually wears away compression along the way. This method I've outlined will feel weird at every step, but after you try it once, you'll notice a big difference in your engine's performance & lifespan. Hope this helps; give this breakin method a shotyou have nothing to gain except longer life & more power
Link added in original post Was trying to find it
Marky __________________
24112007, 21:30
Marky BMP
#4 Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Basingstoke Hants Posts: 8,761
Apex Models Team Driver
Re: Heat cycle..........running an engine in
Adam Drakes method of heat cycling an engine, slightly different to the above methods, due to not hitting 200* on each tank, but still has the desired effect
__________________
09032008, 23:25
Technex
Numpty of the Month
#5 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: London Posts: 58
Re: Heat cycle..........running an engine in
Deleted Last edited by Technex : 24 082008 at 20:46.
05092008, 20:24
Beanie Active Member
#6 Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: New Haw, Surrey, UK Posts: 1,060
Re: Heat cycle..........running an engine in
The first method suggests keeping the engine at 200 deg. F for a whole tank, but the 'cool guy and drake methods seem to suggest that you get the engine up to roughly 200 and then immediately look to cool it back down by either stopping it, or richening a la Drake? Which is best? up to temp for a whole tank and let it sit at 200 until it runs out of fuel and then cool down or get it up to temp and then immediately shut off, cool down and then restart? __________________ Losi Muggy (Spek, Mach 427/SH.28, 48T Spur, Steering mod, ACE, Silver/White Shock springs, High Temp discs) Losi 8T (Spek, ACE's, Mach427) HPI RS4 EVO 3 BMW (Spek) Maverick Atom XB (Spek) For those long winter nights indoors!! www.ddgraphics.co.uk 05092008, 20:32
damstac Member
#7 Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Newcastle upon tyne Posts: 916
Re: Heat cycle..........running an engine in
I use the Jonny Cool method and it works great but does take a long time to do it properly. __________________ LOSI 8IGHT 2.0 ACE SERVO'S, RB C5bb,RB C6 L2G,PICCO P7R EVO2, CRT.5 SH .12, B44 NOSRAM MATRIX EVO,GM EVO 6.5,
05092008, 22:41
Beanie Active Member
#8 Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: New Haw, Surrey, UK Posts: 1,060
Re: Heat cycle..........running an engine in
Hmm....might combine both methods in a way. Wrap the head and get it up to 200 ASAP, then unwrap it and let it idle at 200 for 34 minutes and then shut it off. Cool down and then start again. Going to do this for 2 tanks and then do the same but this time on the ground using a little throttle and then shut off after 34 minutes. Couple of tanks like that and then maybe start to lean out the HSN a little... __________________ Losi Muggy (Spek, Mach 427/SH.28, 48T Spur, Steering mod, ACE, Silver/White Shock springs, High Temp discs) Losi 8T (Spek, ACE's, Mach427) HPI RS4 EVO 3 BMW (Spek) Maverick Atom XB (Spek) For those long winter nights indoors!! www.ddgraphics.co.uk 19012009, 21:45
Ross71 Member
#9
Join Date: May 2008 Location: Dunstable Posts: 323
Re: Heat cycle..........running an engine in
Quick question for those in the know, can i ask why on the 3rd tank i have to take the car of the starter box, or was this wrote on the 1st of April
Cheers Ross
heat up case to about 210220 degrees before starting up for the first 7 tanks. wrapped head with industrial style paper towels i got from work. tank 1= idle on box, keeping it around 210225 degrees tank 2= same as above tank 3=same as above but this time off the box, just sitting on the deck surface tank 4= on the street with about 25% throttle control. temps got hot REALLY quick. but tamed it down to around 230 tank 5= same as above, but fattened up to run at 220 high tank 6= same as above with 50 % throttle control. temps holding great tank 7= unwrapped head. leaned out alot to get hotter temps tank 8= unwrapped head, ran at 75% throttle. tank 9 = start to race tune, but keeping it slightly on the rich side (HSN) __________________ Muggy RB928,JP-3,Ace's,lots more for sale soon
Mugen MBX5-T. Caster K8-T Losi ? coming soon
19012009, 21:56
S3 NUTT Member
#10 Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: S.Wales Posts: 408
Re: Heat cycle..........running an engine in
Yes thats what i thought I just went with it __________________ XB 808 RB WS7111 ENGINE ACE SERVO'S 3GR 2.4 LOSI 8T RB S7 ACE,HITEC SERVO'S 'GWENT NITRO RACERS' Page 1 of 2 1 2 > « Previous Thread | Next Thread »
Posting Rules You may not post new threads You may not post replies You may not post attachments You may not edit your posts vB code is On Smilies are On [IMG] code is On HTML code is Off
Forum Jump Engine tech corner
Go
All times are GMT +1. The time now is 15:24. Contact Us MaxBashing Archive Top
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.8 Copyright ©2000 2009, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. Stoney Castle Publushing Ltd
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