Dh B2 Andrew Card White House Fdr- Transcript- Ron Fournier Ap Interview- Non Responsive Material Redacted

•rin--. WHITE HOUSF O f f i c e - of

RECEIVED

l.hr? Pros:; S e c r e t a r y

Auqust '/,

I n t e r n a l Transcript

MAY 2 2 2 0 0 3

200?.

National Commission on Terrorist Attacks

INTERVIEW OP CHIEF OF .STAFF ANDRl-.'W CARD BY RON FOURN IER OI-1 AP O f f i c e of

t lio C h i e f

oi . S t a f f

2 : 1 0 P . M . liDT

your

0 I ' d k i n d oi l i k o to s t . a r t , you - j u s t w a l k mo t.riroucjh e x p e r i e n c e of 9 / 1 1 , and t hem let.'.s s e u u e .

M R . CARD: T h a t ' . ' ; a day none of u.s iv i J I evei J oj get , a I I h o u q b my more? m e m o r a b l e day is act.ua.l \y .Sept omboi M t - . l i . IHit. Sept ember l l t . h , I remoniber c j e r t i IKJ u}-), f co I i nq as i f t ho I'r o:; i dont was cjoing to have v;h,it [ c a l l .1 ; ; < ) f t c i a y . Wo woi o cjo.i ncj to do n r e a d . i i K j , and ho -/;crit for a run on i ho qo i f coiir.sf 1 i l u w n at w h a t e v e r t ho t o n n i : ; n r j d boric)) c l u l ; v,,i:; /.•" v ; c r c • • , t < r / i i i ( ] at . A m i t horo war:> a . s t . r n n q cji'lor i n t ! i o a i r . 1 d o n ' t i oincmbor i t ycui t hie bc: t c;a 1 i /. c-'d, but .1 had no concept of. w h a i : h a ( } > i q c i o r day .va.-: . ( h i t 1 k r j e w it wa;; c / o i n c j Lo lie a s o f t d a y . I w a y l o o k i n q l o j w a r d l o <;pc'!iiiq my ;; j r , tor who had come? down to t h e nchoo! f i o.'ri '1'al 1 aha:;:u?o.', and :;o T was q o i n c ) I. o see my s i ;U er at t h e school . O a h i C K J I >r

Can ! st.op y o u ? W h y ( J j d y o u t ) ) j ; i k day boc - ti'i«;c? i t 'was ?.-.neh a so V^' l~S

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M R . CARD: Yo:;, bec-ausc? i t . was such a s o f t d a y . I reinembor b e i n c j s t r u c k 1 wakc j u}) e a r l y a n y w a y , };ut I woko up oar 1 i or' t h a n i n o r m a l J y do. And T was; k i n d of c h a r q e d and r e a d y to uo, w o n d e r i n g w h o r e t he P r e s i d e n t w a s , and he was a l r c ? a d y out runniricj. And so 1 was k i n d of w a i t i n c j for t lie d.»y ' o b(?y i n , w i t h c i n t i ci pa t i o n , C^VHJI I houcjh I knew i t was ,: so f t d a y .

000027

r

And 1 remember g o i n g irit.o the h o l d l n e j room b e f o r e he went i n t o t h e 1 c 1 assi'oom, and it w < i s J ri t h e h o l d i n g room t h a t !">i t u d t i e>n was t r y i n g to roach u s . Cal (?) got. on t h e - phone-, was t o ! el a p l a n e - had hit the Wor 1 el Traele C e n t e r , the f i r s t p l a n e . f then jumped on the? phone and we t a .Iked •• • j u s t , b e f o r e t h e P r e s i d e n t went i n t o the room w L t h the school k i e l s , T remember we? had a ve°j y b r i e f c o n v e r s a t i o n , but it was what, a h o r r i b l e a c e - j d e n t , t he pi J e^t must have; had a h e a r t a t t a c k . And we t h o u g h t t h a t i t w a s a t w i n - e n g i n e prop p l a n e ? a t that, p o i n t . Q

Those? were' the-* f i r s t

reports;

M K . CARD: A t w i n - e n g i n e prop p l a n e , h o r r i b l e a c c i d e n t , p i l o t m u s t have had a h e a r t a t t a c k . And he went i n t o the classroom. i then • we got a t e l e v i s i o n i n t o the h o l d i n g room t h e n , so we did some l o g i s t i c s t h i n g s -t e l e v i s i o n in, get the t e l e v i s i o n e j n . Ariel then word carne? t h a t a second p l a n e h a d h i t a n e l t h a t t h e ? f i r s t p l a n e w a s a j e t l i n c ? r a n e l t h e second p l a n e was a j e t l i n e r . And J remember t f u n k i n g to m y s e l f , what w o u l d f want to k n o w i I I w e r f t ho P r e s i d e n t , w h i c h is k . i n e l e > f my t e s t f e~>r a day And I w o u l e l w a n t l e) k n o w . And se) 1 stood I cracked t h e door i n t o the e:.l a s s r e>om t lie h o l d i n r j room was; l i e j h t ne>xl to t h e - c l a s s r o o m . Anel I c r . a e - k e e l t h e de>or e>pen and I i s I e-Mie^d , and ! could heaj students t a l k i n e i J a c ' t . u a l l y h e a r e ! a t oae'her t a i k i r i g r i n d s t u d c ' i i t s i es3pune] i nei . And 1 e ] e c - i d e ' e J t h a t [ w o u l d s t e p i n t o t ho r oe.nn a n e l l i s t e n for a t i m e ? to i n t e r r u p t . .Sen 1 t o o k one s t e > p i n t e ; t h e ? room, s t o o d back a g a i n s t the wa I 1 t lie' door was s h u t anel I looked over anel r saw the pre-ss poo] . And J t h i n k it was'; Ann Compton who look eel up at rue. she> m o u t h e d , " w h e a t ' s ; up, " e^r s o m e t h i n g . And r h e ? l d up two f i n g e r s , ' and r n e > u t h e e l , "second p l a n e . ' . " Then t h e r e 1 w a s a s l i g h t , b r e a k i n t h e meet. I J K . J a n e l t h a t when F w o n t up to the P r e s i d e n t , w h i s p e r eel i n t o h i s ear . t . r j e e J t o be ve j r.y, very ef f J ci erjJ^--wT"frFr my worejs, a n e cemsc i OIM;! y (jJ^rrrfenTT T sa'fd, "A second p l a n e hit t h e t eiv/ei^^—rcrTTei i e - a is u n c l e a r . i t ' t a c k . " T h a t ' s ; l i t c ^ r a l ly w h a t I i in. Q D i d ye)ii know a t t h e t i m e - it was short ly a f t e r the s;t'com1 p l a n e h i t . w e he-are: t h a t , t h e F B I s u s p e c t e d t h a t t h e > s e planes were h i j a c k c ? d . D i d y o u know a t t h e 1 t i m e t h a t t he;y w o r e h i jacked? MK . C A K D :

f eli d not .

000028

Q

A l 1 you

kii(-~'w was two

jpt l i n e r s , two Ioweic.

MK. (,'AKi): I knew t h a t j i c o u l d n ' t have been a coincidence. So rny editor.ia.l comment was "America is under attack." It was a factual statement , a second piano hit the second tower; and the editorial comment was that. "America is under attack." And that was my own judgment because 1 just it couldn't be a coinci denco. And 1 stopped bock, and then - - stepped back to the doorway. And lie w a i t e d , i don't know, maybe 30 seconds, not very long, and then fie excused himself from the classroom and came into the holding zoom. Q Let me stop you here for a minute. The phrase, "America .is under a t t a c k , " did you do any kind of internal e d i t i n g , t h i n k i n g t h r o u g h t h a t phrase, thinking through exactly what: you were- going to say before you walked up to him, or did .it l i t e r a l l y 'just HH . CAP.fi: No, h i in ticLotc I went words.

I ' houeiht about what I was going t o say t o I wanted to ho very e f f i c i e n t w i t l i my

Q Why did you t h i n k J l was important to tell him that, t h a t America was undc-v. a t t a c k ? One course could have been -just t e l 1 hi in wh.it happened and let him make his own cone: 1 usi on. Why did y o u decide t o in,ike t h . i t e d i t o r i a l comment, a s y o u t o l d i t ? MK. f'AKiJ: .1 CHIPS:-. I wanted him to know the griivity of .it . .1 viewed t h i s as a ve.'y g r a v e situation, so F used those words. But. more t h a n t h a t , J wanted it to be very succinct. T did not want to stand up in Iront. of the cameras and have a conversation w i t h h i m . 1 d i d n ' t want him to turn to me and say, what are you t a l k i n g about . .So [ t r i < •< I l o pick terms that would not i n v i t e a ronver sat i on. y

And

i t worked.

MR. C.'AKD: 1 don ' t know t h a t be I or e I d i d i t , but

I knew that

it would work

y .'Jo he gels t h < ' message "loud and clear at t h e event, arid he walks out .

000029

r

MR. CARL): Then he came i n t o ' hie h o l d i n g room and qot on t h e phone, t a l k e d t o t h e S i t u a t i o n Room O

lie did?

MR. CARD: Q

He d i d .

Do yon know who he t a l k e d t.o?

MR. CARD: I b e l i e v e - i t was C o n d i . Arid by then, we had CNN on, or Fox, one o( t h e - s t a t ions on on the TV in the ho.lding room, so we could see i t . And they kept p l a y i n g it. over and over , the planes crash i rig i n . And so you could see it. And then we quickly moved i n t o q o t t i n g ready to move from that venue on to Air Force One, m a k i n g sure that Secretary Paige knew and could take over the event , which was in a larger auditorium; crafted what t he Pr e.s i dent would say when he walked out into the aud ; t on urn. Q (low did I l l i c i t w r i t mo process qoV remarks he had on t h e at t ticks..

That

was the First

MR. CARD: We stood t h e r e and Ari was t h e r e , K a r l Rove, Dan Hart: J e t I no yes., IVm was there. And t lie President was w r i t i n g I lie remarks, so t h e y weren't w r i t t e n for h i m , he was wr i i i nu I hem.

0

W i t h input

f r o m t h i s qroup,

I assume.

MH . C A R D : Y e s , wo v . - i - r e , t l j :; t and i nq a r o u n d t a 1 k i nq . I t h e n r a n cm t t o c h e c k t I •.< • ! ou : s t j cc; i n t h e ina i n , T t. h.i nk i t was a ( j y m n a s i u m , and l e t t h e a d v a n c e I vain • r.aicJ the- President. w o u l d b e l e a v i n g , . S e c r e t , M V ! a i c j i - ' w o u l d b e s t a y i n g ; qot t h e word to 5;eo r r?t ar y P a i g e 3 . So 1 did k i n d of the l o q i n t Lcs r > L d e of i t . A c t u a l l y d i d t r a c k my s i s t e r down and s a i d t.o my s i s t e r , two plane?:-; c r a s h e d i n t o t h e W o r l d T r a d e C e n t e r i n M e w Y o r k , a n d w e ' r e e m i n q t o have t o l e a v e , w o c a n ' t s t a y . .','ho qave me a h u g ; tha t w r i s a l l i sa i d t ( • h e j . (.)

D i d she s<-iy air, t h i n u t o you?

MR. CARD: .She was k i n d oi in shock . She came' bubbling up to me? • she had no c l u e what was qoing on. Because these peop I e had been in t h a t room a h a l f an hour ahead of time. I did say, pay at tent i or: . Two planes hit the WorJd Trade Center in New York, and we're q o i n u t o have t.o leave.

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c o m m u n i c a t i o n s w a s e s t a b l i s h e d w i t h Washi n g t . o n , w i t h t.lio . S i t u a t i o n Koc>m, w i t . l i t lie PKOC, who wns JIM the.- PKOC, w h e - r o wa.s the v i c e Pr o.s i d e n t . Went t h r o u q h t h o s e k i n d s of i o q . i s t i c s . 0 curious.

How did you d e t e r m i n e who as Had (.here a l r e a d y been

in

l he PKOC?

.1 ' i n j u s t ,

MR. CARD: Situation tells us. So they t o l d u s . C a p t a i n hauer (?) .in the S i t u a t i o n Room, who i s now A c . L m . i r a J , a w o m a n , was on the p i a n o and she? was t h e repr esent.a t i vo of t h e NSC on the t r i p . .So she d i d a lot of t h e 1 eqwoi k , r u n n i n g u p s t a i r s , u p t o t h e c o m m u n i c a t i o n s team o n t l i o p l a n e . And then I h u d d l e d -t h e P r e s i d e n t k i n d of worked the phones w i t h t lie V i c e P r e s i d e n t arid S e c r e t a r y K u m s f e l d . I spent q u i t e ? a bit of t i m e up in his .sleeping area on t lie p l a n e , t a l k i n q w i t h t h e Secret .Service arid t h e M i J i t a r y O f f i c e a b o u t w h a t w e s h o u l d d o w i t h t h e p l a n e , w h a t t h e t h r e a t s w e r e , where 1 s h o u l d we go. Anel we were.' f l y i n g a sc^rpenl i ne j e n i t e , j aneied in F..OU i s i a n a . O

Why was L o u i s i a n a chosen?

MI<. CARD: l - ' i r s t of. a 1 1 , it haei a lonq r u n w a y . It was a has i.1 t h a t was a l r e a d y on a l e r t because?, / or I. u i i ous.l y , t h e y wej e r u r m j T i q an e x e r c i s e , so I hey were a l r e a d y on a l e r t and e > b v i o u s l y , had goe>d c:ommtin i c:at i o n s . Arid i t was we! 1 out of t h e way o f a n y t h i n g i n t h e area where t h e P r e s i d e n t v/as i n F l o r i d a . B u t >ve I r i ed t.o keep it v e r y q u i e t as t o w i n .• e •-•.•<• v.-e-i e q o i n q . U ye;>u were.

I r emenibei

M ! ^ . CARD:

-

1 was

Then w e went

here.-,

t r y i n g t o [ i nd out

wlieie

f r o m there up t o N e b r a s k a .

(,) f she^ulel have knowr t . ) ) i s o f f . t h e l o p of n-y h t % < K ) w h e r e was I he f i r s t • the n e x t p r e s i d e n t l a l <;l « i t ement was Barksdale, wasn't it?

i ri

MH . CAKD: Tn I,oui.siana we maele a s t a t e m e n t , and i t was by t a p e . Wo went, to one c o n f e r e n c e room and hael a b r i e f m e e t i n g a n d e l o c i d e d t h a t i t won! el b e b e t t e r t o b r i n g t h e 1 p r e s s t o where t h e cominaneier of. the ba.se1 w a s , te; his c o n f e r e n c e t oom. .So we moveel p r o b a b l y anothe?r mi l < ^ and a h a l f I roru orje c f ) n ) e i e u c e f a c i l i t y t o t h e commander':; o f f i c e . W e h a d ine?c.'t i ) K j s i n t h e c o m m a n d e r ' s o f f i c e , telephone m e e t i n e j s back h e r e w i t h W a s h i n g t o n a n d t h e ? Defense D e p a r t m e n t . A n d we? e ' r a f t e e ! t h e s t a t e - m e r i t . , a n d

000032

then he gave t:he statement there. out. to you guys. Q

It. was on tape, mid then sent

Why was .Sept- ember '14th more memorable to you?

MR. CARD: W e l l , it. related to how J saw the President, being President. The J4t. h was that. Friday, and it. was a day that included some very unusual things. The President, did his CIA b r i e f i n g in the morning; lie did an FBI briefing that m o r n i n g , arid 1:hat wa.s the morning when T think t h a t lie basically directed a c u l t u r e change in t'he FBI. T don't think many Presidents have had briefings from FBI directors. Maybe going back to Kennedy days; or before, they did. But in my adult l i f e t i m e , Presidents don't normally meet with FBI director to get an intelligence briefing. This President d i d . And during that briefing, the FBI Director focused <>j! what happened on September 1 1 t h : they got an the planes h e r e , they got t h e i r r i c k c t s there. And the President kind of j ii t ei r ~upt ed him and said, t h i s is not about b u i l d i n g a case for prose-cut ion, t h i s should be about preventing t h e next at lack. What ' s the1 inf el .1 i gence on the next attack:' And t h a t was a ci.l t ure change to the FBI. Their psyche had been b u i it , in my opinion, around f i n d i n g spies and b u i l d i n g cases for [>r'.>soou t j on . 0 What was h i s demeanor when he said t h a t ? of flipping o f f Mueller

Was i t k i n d

MR. CAR!): No, no. It was a l i t t l e - bit of a b r u p t s h i f t . It was I i k e , t h a t 's not what we're here about . ft was kind of i t was d i r ect i ona 1 . 0

And M u e l l e r had no reason to

MR. CARP: Oh, no, it wasn't hostile, it wasn't" ! t h i n k i t was a mindset s h i f t that t lie President S t a r t t i n nk; no about pr even t i nci the next at.tack. (,) Now, is, t h i s something that you guys had before t h a t meet, .i ng?

i t was fomrnanded.

t a l k e d about

MR. CARD: \d talked to the President either on Wednesday or Thursday -- must have been Thursday, thru, f would recommend t h a t he get an FBI b r i e f i n g , because the f.'JA does not collect i n t e l l i g e n c e inside t h e "Jnited States. And these

000033

attackers all carne i roin inside the United States. And lie said, yes, he wanted to have an FBI hrietincj. So that 's how it. star teel. Q 'In your head were you thinking t h e reason to get t ho FBI in there is be>cause they don't get Intelligence from inside t ho United States •- were you thinking i t ' s because you need to bo brie} eel, .sir, by these folks; on what, happened in tin? U.S. about 9 / 1 1 , or were you t h i n k i n g you need to be b r i e f e d about

MR. CARD: 1 was thinking, we should know what's happeming in the United States. It's one thing to know what, happened in the U n i t e d 5>tates, but we should know what i 5; happening in the U n i t ed States. 0 Wan the? re any thing in that: conversation w i t h the? Pros i dent, t h e private? conversation, that indicated that he was /nokinq that Jeap, as; w e l l ? MR. CARD: Oh, he d e f i n i t e l y was. lie war; d e f i n i t e J y focusing on prevent ing t ho next a t t a c k . And pun i .sh i nq those who conducted t h e at tack. Ho .had moved, on 5->opt ember "12th, we're going to get those guys. He was t bo; e was no doubt in my mind that ho viewed thir; as an act of war. (,) Muol Ler walk:; i n , g i v i n g the President, of t he United St.it I-;; t In- k i n d of br i f f :mi he'd always given and expected t o (j i v t • MR. CARD: / ^ d u a l l y , again, I don't t h i n k and FR1 director ever gave any brief, ing. C> But he's coming in w i t h the mindset aJ 1 o{ us would have, J o t ' s t e l l t h e Pro.si dent what happened on t h i s horrendous day jus;t t hree or four days e a r l i e r . And the President says, no, I want to know wh t -tt we're doing to prevent the next one. What was his reaction when he? got t h a t , s h i f t of MR. CARD: Ho basic-ally said, we'll f i n d out, we' 1 ] look. And i t was a culture s h i f t . And there's not a doubt in my mind that he went back over to tlic FBI and said, the President wants us to be able to answer the questions as what's coming next, and how do we prevent it irorn happening. T don't want you to stop there on the J 41 h, because; t h a t happened I o be? the ( i r:5;l hemr of the day. The CTA, FBI war; in

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the f i r s t 30 minvit.cs of the day. The President then held a Coin not meeting, and it. was a remarkable Cabinet, meeting be?causo t h e President used i lie term, "war council." He obviously, r a i l e d on the Sec-rot t u y of State and the Secretary of. Defense and t he A t t o r n e y General. But then I was .imp reused w i t h how (.hie Fr es id (-.Tit went around the Cabinet table and talked about the r espons ibi 1 i t ies of each Cabinet member ••I ' l l be l i g h t i n g this war against terrorism and ho called i t a war talked about the war council. He talked about the role that .State had to play and Defense had to play and the Justice Depa r t rnent had to play. But then he went -- he talked about the need for others to do their job for the taxpeiycrs . We've got to continue to work on housing. Me] Martinez; and you've got to continue to work on I lie environment, C h r i s t i e Todd Whitman; and you've got to cont inue to work on tho economy, Paul O ' N e i l 1 . And he went around, l i t e r a l l y , to every Cabinet member, and he t o l d them t h e i t mission leave- no child behind in education; we've? got to make sure all of the funct. ions of the government are working w h i l e wc.> get the.se people. And it was an inclusive- meeting anci i t showed the breadth oi t h i n k i n g that the President had. And Ui.it was p r e t t y impressive to me, that lie understood t h a t cjovi/t nment had to tunct ion, t h a t it couldn't come t o a r.t .incir.t i l l . lie was worried about the.' shock to the economy of the fjeptember N t h attack. Then a l t e r that Cabinet meetincj arid t h a t had been spectacular. I t was a real sign <>f executive l e a d e r s h i p , the Kxooui. i ve Branch of government . Then we went to t h e N.it i ona I Cathedral for a p r a y e r service. And t h a t was an uni»• I i ovab 1 r> experience. You hud an imam and a i abbi and an orthodox p r i e s t , you had a Catholic priest, you had an Kpiscopalian m i n i s t e r , you had B i l l y Graham g i v e the last sermon to i he w o r l d , b a s i c a l l y , t h a i he' 11 give in hi;; l i f e probably. And t h e President, made comments, we sang hymns, we prayed. And t i n - .iudi
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f lie-men t h a t were s t i l l missing. And those people were still fi.1 led w i M i hope t h i i l t h e i r loved ones would bo l.ound; they weren't . Bui i l was exlrernoly emotional. Arid lie did not. get. up and g i ve a speech or go to the microphone, he went to each i n d i v i d u a l person, and hugged, cried, laughed, consoled, counseled. And he d i d it. on behalf of all ot us. I t wasn't about h i m , it was about America. And he was c o m f o r t e r in ch.ioL at l.hat. moment . And fie would not be rushed. He was scheduled t a be there for like 4L> minutes; he ended up s l a y i n g lot over two hours. And t lien we got on a plane- and we flew up to Harjerstown and went to (."amp David. And it war, the l i t t l e plane -• it was a couple See-ret Service agents, a doctor, a mil aide, a nurse, me and the President . And he war. completely exhausted. He was emot i o n a l l y exhausted, he war; spiritually exhausted, lie was p h y s i c a l l y exhausted, he was mentally exhausted. But 1 believe that day he did everything that a President could be expected to do. lie was he changed t lie culture in a bureaucracy; broke new ground in term:; of t r y i n g to nnder<;tand what. ' s going on i n s i d e l.hc U n i t e d .Stale:; w i t h regard to i n 1e I 1 J gence and t e r r o r i s t act i v i t y ; convened a Cabinet, talked about convening a war counci 1 a:; Commander in C h i e f ; directed his Cabinet to meet t he i r <>l>\ qa I i ons of govern i Jig . Then he ;ioo:; t <.• I lie-1 Nat ii.-n.il Cathedral arid leads not only Hie nat i e j i , but the whole wor !d in prayer, arid shows that, t h i s if, about soiii' -r In rig bigger t h a n us. And I think the c a l l i n g was real . Then |;i- goes to Now York and r a l l i e s the rescue workers, comfort.''; t h e farni I i os of the v i c t i m s , and sends a message1 to the world t h a t A m e r i c a wi I I be heard. I --• it was just a r erna r kab 1 o d,;y . Q Do you remember any conversation on Marine One going up to Camp Uav i d'.MR. C/\HI): You know, J don't normally talk about rny conversat ions w i t h h i m . And 1 ' rr. a f r a i d to do it. now. But 1 said to h i m , Hr . President, you'te a great President. 1 said, 1 l i t e r a l l y s a i d , 1 have no right to say this, because history wi 1 1 judge il , but you're? a great President. You did everythirig that a President: could ever be expected to do, and you did it in one day. I t a l k e d about his r o l e as Commander in Chief and managing (he government and r a l lying a country and the world, comfort, inn people who were in need. And 1 can't t h i n k eof anything t h a t he did not do w e l l t h a t day.

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(,) the worst

W h a t war; hi;-, r e p l y ' weeks o f h i s l i t e .

Hero's

l h i .'j .'it.

I ho end of. one of

MR. CARD: I d o n ' t c h i n k ho s a i d much. J think ho said, t.hank you, or noniet. h i mj . It was h e ' s not f i J led w i t h braggadocio. H o ' f; a v e r y humble p e r s o n . And 1 d o n ' t r>ee thi.s as1 d o n ' t t h i n k t h a t IK.- bo] i eved t.lii s as about, liiin; 1 think i 1. ' r, about t lie i o:.;pons i b i I i t ! c s t h a i he lias and how ho i s prepared to meet tho:;c t espons i bj 1 i r i or; . .So I see a lot. of f a . i t h J n him t ) i a t «;ilJow:; him t o be nioco huml).le t h a n u J oL oL other pol i t ir i cMi:; w o u l i l be.

Q Tell mo how t h i s year has personally, one way or a n o t h e r . How has it chanqed you?

i t ' G a f f e c t e d a l l o f u; i t n £ f e < : t : e ? c 3 you, h o w

MR. C A R D : How ha:: it f l u i i u j o d mo ' I quo-?;:'; T crome t.o appi ec i a t o m o r e 1 ( > x < > e t ly whiil we have as a n a t i o n , and how much re:.;pert I have (or I he s p i r i t o f our people. T d o n ' t think anyone c o u l d have a n t i c i p a t e d hew many peuplo u n i t e d in America a f t e r September 1 I t h . I I ' :. a l m o s t a:; if I here was a ruaqic wand t h a t went over t he land and a l lowed people I o reoocjn i /o how p o t t y t ho d i I 1 c>r oncer, a i e , but how common out v a l u e s are. And so we t e n d e d l o f o c u s i n o r i - on I ho v a l u e r ; t h a n wo did on the pet I y d i f f er enoes. And t h a ; i mpi ossrd me. 1 f e e l a:; if 1 am e x t r a o r d i n a r i l y l u c k y to be w h e r e I am. and I know t h a t 1 am w h e t e f earn because of t ho count r y and I he s y s t em t ha I. wo have, not because of any t.h i nq 1 d i < i .

NON-RESPONSIVE MATERIAL

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NON-RESPONSIVE MATERIAL

Anci t.hi s was the name t h i n g on .Sept ember 1 l i b . I s a i d , t i n s is a job that: has to bo done and I'm going i-o make sure it gets clone?. I went righl. to i. hi.' .Seer el .Service and i went r i g h t to t h e A i r Force crowd, and .said, wc> have a job t <> do, now we've (jot. t.o do it... Let':; ge?l I ho mot oread-. • up here, let ' :; get people moving. 0 You've changed in way:;, 1 ' vo changed in w<-iyr;, everybody ha:> chunqcul in way.s. How has t h e President., George Bush a.s a man, boon af l e r l ed by ')/ I 1? MR. CARD: W e l l , everybody i n America was -1 think everybody in t h e world was a L f e e t e d who is a c i t i z e n of the? world. I mean, if you're? i n f o anarchy, you probably didn't change. But. I don't think t h e chataeter of the Presidc?nt. changed at a l l . i t h i n k what happened was more people1 came to see the character of the President. A giant, spotlight wont on the President , and you arc- now seeing arid you saw it. before, so .1 ' m riot - people now SOB what even you probably saw when lie was a candidate. 0 The problem is when I ask thai question, people around here think f 02 a (• ranslormat ion of the.' President MR. CARD:

There was no t i a n s f o r mat ion

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has

Q he

Right, that's riot the quest-ion I'm asking.

I ' rn asking

-•

MR. CARD: I think that, he sees now a mission. There is a calling that, has come to him, and C don't mean this as a religious calling. There is a responsibility that .is resting on his shoulders, and he understands that. And he w i l l carry the responsi bi 1 i t:y through to its end, even when you've forgotten about i t . And 7 think that.' s what's changed. He is a man with a mission. Tt is a higher calling for, I think, freedom and democracy and civilization. You know, the strcinge thing about the atvtack on Sept ember llth, every other attack that t h e United States has had to suffer through - - and that, may bo an overstatement •• but any other attack of any magnitude that America had to suffer through came from either another nation or another philosophy the Civil War, World War I, World War I J , the SpanishAmerican War, the Cold War. This attack came 1 rom people who are interested in anarchy. They weren't looking to introduce another philosophy, they weren't looking to introduce another government, they weren't looking to replace our system w i t h their system. They were Looking to introduce anarchy. And that mean;; that this enemy is [at d i f f e r e n t than any enemy we faced before. And I t h i n k t he: P; or, ideni. understands that. 0 - - a quick list, oi some things; where people close to him have said, again, he hasn't transformed, but whore they notice he has been affected or changed by i t . lie's always been a great delegator, a man who knows the v a J u e of his office's time. Does he delegate more or less, or t fie .same a.s lie did before? MR. CARD: He is a very, very eff i c i e n t man, and he has beer) very efficient. Does he delegate more? lie knows that there are still only 2'1 hours in a day, and that the workload of a President certainly was not diminished by September llth, so it wasn't that things were taken off hi.c3 table so that he could have more time to deal with winning t h e - war against terrorism. He had to find more room on his table to do the job. So, yes, he had to delegate issues that might have risen to him that now could be massaged by others. Q Can you think of a minor example that wouldn't give away secrets? The kind of issue that just

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MR. CARD: He knew that he had cjood people working on education reform. He'd already one congressional pa.ssaqe, arid he could s.iy, let's qet it done. .So he d i d n ' t have t.<> micromanaqe t h e i rnp Lementat i on of his qoa L to leave no c h i l d behind. He could say. Rod Paiqe, Marqaret Spellinqs, do i i . And r t biink thiit t.hat's kind o£ what he did at LhaL Cabinet meetinq on the 14th. 1 Lhink he went around that tabJo, in essence, saying, T am going to have to .spend more l.ime focusing on t i n s war; therefore, don't forget the job you have t o do. And so I t h i n k that may have boon a deleqal. i on N wi t hout forethouqht.

NON-RESPONSIVE MATERIAL

Q In private, in down tiine.<;, doe.'", he? joke more, or len than he 'did a year aqo? MR. CARD: I i.hj rik lie did joke less, but he is now jokituj I t h i n k the burden of September l l L h t h a t lasted u n t i l October 7i h October 7th is the day t h a t wo1 went i n t o Af qhari j :.;tan. That period of t i m e was very, very heavy, because decisions were beinq made then that would have l i t e r a l ly consequence:; for l i t e or death. October 7th beqan an operational phase, but the decisions t o qel t h e r e ? wei e vei y

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heavy. And he took he spent a .lot of Lime thinking after he had been consulted by Rumsfeld and Powell and Dick Myers remember Shel ton had done the? cusp, Shelton was on the cusp. So that was a heavy time. There? wasn't an opportunity for frivolity during that period of time. But that's also when we were? meeting six days a week. Q That's cilways been an important part of his personality -•- we're% seeing more of it now than you did MR. CARD: I do. I see when he relaxes, he really relaxes. For the month between September llth and October l l t h , that period of t i m e , first of a l l , he didn't have a lot of time to be frivolous. But part of my job is to make sure that the 24 hours in a day are scheduled such that the President does have time, I like to call it, eat, sleep and be merry. He has to eat, he has to sleep, has to have time to go to the bathroom, and he has to have time to be merry. Arid that period of t i m e , it was very d i f f i c u l t to schedule the merry part. And lie enjoy;; a rnovio every once in a w h i l e ; he enjoys reading; he? enjoys t a l k i n g with Jerma and Barbara. And even that was hard to schedule during that period of time. Yet i t ' s very important. So I try to focus, T pay attention, "1 try to pay attention to the f u l l 24 hour cycle, no that he has time to eat, slc-.'ep and bo merry. Because if he's merry, hi:; dec i 55 ions w i l l be better. Q And l a s t l y - because I've gone over my t i m e other than the obvious, the? new focus an overriding mission now for the administration, tho war on terrorism how has 9/31 changed t h i s presidency? MR. CARD: The p r i o r i t y is not a priority that, was anticipated. The p r i o r i t y when we got olc-ctod, whc-n the? President got elected, was education reform, t a x relief, and a compassionate agenda reflecting conservative values. And we were chugging along with actually pretty phenomenal success, s u r p r i s i n g the pundits - these? are all s t i l l p r i o r i t i e s , but there's an overarching responsibility that t lie President now is carrying for the world. And so, yes, we have to focus more resources on meeting the challenge that we didn't anticipate. I like to say we elect Presidents to meet challenges that can't be anticipated. You don't elect a President to devil with the issues that everybody knows about . You really pick a President, you pick a leader to

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be able to manage the unknown. This President has demonstrated the capacity to manage the unknown challenge. And he knows that lie has a biggor rosponsib: l i t y t. o do it . That's why I'm proud to work for him, because he puts things in the right perspective. He's just -- he's good at compartmentalizing, but never losing the overall mission. Some people can compartmentalize and lose the overall mission; and he doesn't. I don't want to do anything that gets in the way of us winning the war against terrorism; I don't want to do anything that gets in the way of: protecting the homeland. And that's why he is comfortable with the new challenges that are imposed on other agenda items. You don't understand -- yes, I care about this program, but I can't let rny care about this program get in the way of achieving our overall goal of winning the war on terrorism. Q

Okay.

Thank you vory much. END

2 : 5 8 P . M . EOT

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