T5 B65 Gao Visa Docs 5 Of 6 Fdr- 7-2-02 Gao Interview Of Ftttf 805

.Prepared by: Jody Woods Date: 7/3/2002 Job Code: 320087

Index: Type bundle Index here DOC Library: Type library name here DOC Number: 152402

FTTTF, 7/2/02 Reviewed by: Type reviewer name here Review Date: Type review date here

Record of Interview Purpose

We met ^^ staff of tne Foreign Terrorist

Tracking Task Force (FTTTF) to discuss their progress on risk assessment and condor cables and to obtain their views on visa policy and law.

Contact Method

In person

Contact Place

FTTTF Offices, Crystal City

Contact Date

July 2,2002

Participants

GAP

Jody Woods, Senior Analyst Kate Brentzel, Analyst Gabrielle Anderson, Analyst Fl'lTF Ihief of Staff, Deputy Director for Law and Policy (703) Risk Assessment Condor Processing

Risk Assessment

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Jreported that risk assessment is currently being conducted on only flight school applicants that are already licensed pilots. It will be opened up to all flight school applicants after the Department of Justice finishes the comment period on its new rule.l [stated that she doubted the irriTK would ever conduct risk assessment modeling on all visa applicants, simply because it would be too difficult to transfer the visa applications to electronic format. She stated that there is widespread resistance in the State Department to automating the 156 and 157 forms. In contrast, the flight school applications are fully automated. Applicants seeking training at flight schools must fill out an online form and receive approval from the Attorney General. Those that qualify for expedited processing are run through the risk assessment model and turned around in 48 hours or less. For those applicants that come up as hits through risk assessment.! beported that the task force turns the case over to law enforcement to make a decision on what should be done. When asked if the profile used for risk assessment could be disseminated to consular officersr |said no because it was (a) classified and (b) changed daily.

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Record of Interview

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Prepared by: Jody Woods Date: 7/3/2002 Job Coda:320087

When asked what consular officers overseas should do if someone applies for a visa to get flight training^ [stated that they should fill out another form to see whether they qualify for expedited processing. If they don't qualify, they should not be given a visa Even if the visa is issued, the KlTl'F can use INS to track the person down.

20-day hold

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Jstated that all parties agreed that the 20-day wait was not being checked, and Was therefore of limited utility. She believed that State was planning to act on the 20-day wait immediately. She got the impression that State would soon end the 20-day wait.

Condor Processing Icables.

Jexplained that 4 of the 38 FTTTF staff process Condor First they get the paper cable from FBI and sort it by post, refugee case, and cable number. They run the names of the applicants against the VICTOFF database, TIPOFF, INS Absconders, stolen passports, I-94s, NIPC Databases, the Pentbomb investigation, and other law enforcement databases. For those cases with hits, they conduct further research to verify the hit and the applicant are the same person. They consider a case to bfe a match if the two have the exact same name, date of birth, and possibly passport number, country of birth and other biographical information. They stated that when in doubt of a match, they always err on the side of security. Once they have made a match they refer the case with a recommendation to the FBI's Counter-Terrorism Division to make a final decision on the case. On cases where no hit came up, the FTTTF immediately sends word to the State Department that the case has been cleared. When asked how the information in their systems compares with C L A S S J I s t a t e d that CLASS does not include data on lost or stolen passports, intelligence from allied foreign governments, or the Pentbomb investigation. She also noted that the information in CLASS is mainly biographical in nature, whereas the information in the FBI system is in reference to case files.! [stated that the differences between the databases that FBI has and CLASS will grow over time.

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Istated that the FBI/NIPC is in the process of getting ready to take over the Condors.r [stated that the FTTTF will not be allowed to shift it oyef to them until they know it will be done right, unlike the first time when it was not given a high priority. When the FTTTF began the Condor processing they inherited a 14,000 case backlog from the FBLI Istated that these came in the form of boxes and boxes full of paper cables. She suggested we contact| | ]at FBI for more information on their readiness to take over condor processing. Jstated that the contents of the condor cables vary greatly by post, Most have little more information than a name, date of birth, Country of birth, and reasons why they fell into condor criteria. All three taskforce representatives felt that condor processing would proceed much more smoothly if they were given electronic copies of the applications to reviewj Stated that while State is buying more scanners, they have resisted her idea of developing a web-based

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Record of Interview

Prepared by: Jody Woods Date: 7/3/2002 Job Code: 320087

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application because of the availability of internet connections overseas and translatQrs .within the State Department. As it is.l ifelt the paper cables they were getting from State did not contain enough information to conduct a thorough'"risk assessment on thei applicant. [__J "\ stated that at the very least they needed the information on the ~..DS 156 and 157. I

Istated that the CIA is also processing condors. She stated that her contact in State for condorsrsl land for refugees is

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Concerns about Visa Law

' She noted that State was not issuing the visa either, just demanding more informalion on the cast.-. Jagreed to compile data for GAO on how many of these cases ultimately ended up Lbeing recommended for refusal. ' See Annitage letter.

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Record of Inrrrview

Prepared by: Jody Woods Date: 7/3/2002 Job Code: 320087

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application because of the availability of internet connections overseas and translators within the State Department.As it is.l Jfelt the .paper cables they were getting from State did not contain enough information to conduct a thorough risk assessment on the applicant. |_ I I stated that at the very least they needed the information on the DS 156 and 157. [stated that the CIA is also processing condors. She stated that her contact in State for condors is| [and for refugees is I

Concerns about Visa Law

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She noted that State was not issuing Lhe visa either, just demanding more information on tlie case.

(agreed lo compile data for GAO on how many of these cases ultimately ended up being recommended for refusal ' See Annitage letter

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, . ^^cncu ijy. JUUy V V O O Q S

Date: 7/3/2002 Job Code:320087

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State Department Policy

J stated that beyond the question of law, another problem in visa processing is that State Department needs to change its culture away from customer service and efficiency and toward security. She was unclear on how the creation of the department of Homeland Security might change the culture around visa processing.

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' Auditor's Note: If DOJ is successful in convincing State Department to refuse the Condors on the basis of research by the FTTTF, that could expand the number of applicants denied under 212(a)3(h

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Date: 7/3/2002 Job Code:320087

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State Department Policy

Jstated that beyond the question of law, another problem in visa processing is that State Department needs to change its culture away from customer service and efficiency and toward security. She was unclear on how the creation of the department of Homeland Security might change the culture around visa processing.

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1 Auditor's Note: If DOJ is successful in convincing State Department to refuse the Condors on the basis of research by the FTTTF, that coiild expand the number of applicants denied inuler 2l^(a>'i(

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