Searching~a Community Forum

Searching [Tread from “A Community Forum” (http://members.boardhost.com/ACF)] Searching - Robert December 2, 2006, 3:29 pm Re: Searching - Charlotte December 2, 2006, 6:37 pm Re: Searching - Tom December 2, 2006, 7:33 pm Re: Searching - Tom December 3, 2006, 8:03 am Re: Searching - Boki December 2, 2006, 9:20 pm Re: Searching - Robert December 4, 2006, 10:28 am Re: Searching - Boki December 5, 2006, 11:18 am Re: Searching - Jon December 4, 2006, 7:47 pm Re: Searching - Charlotte December 4, 2006, 8:15 pm Re: Searching - Jon December 4, 2006, 8:21 pm Re: Searching - Robert December 5, 2006, 3:56 pm Re: Searching - Tom December 5, 2006, 4:25 pm Re: Searching - Boki December 5, 2006, 7:42 pm Re: Searching - Robert December 5, 2006, 4:40 pm ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Searching ~ Posted by Robert on December 2, 2006, 3:29 pm Hello all, I was bible studying this morning and a particular word struck my fancy and so I had to do a Google search on it. Amongst the many hits I came up with was a sight that perhaps some of you have been to before, I have anyway. That particular word I was looking for was sword. I wanted to know what it symbolizes in the scriptures and as I usually do, I like to drawn on other peoples opinions. At the site Bible.com I came across the article entitled "What Does the Bible Say About.....The Mark of God or the Mark of the Beast?" written very well by Betty Miller (yes you woman are some pretty intelligent creatures!) by my standards. She came across a scripture that I am sure we all are familiar with that hit on what I was looking for, KJV Ephesians 6:17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God: By the way, Betty Miller gives some good information about symbolism in the book of Revelation that is a good refresher course to some and maybe new knowledge for others. I don't buy everything she says in this article but this really stood out in my mind. She mentions the fact that the beast in Revelation (KJV Revelation 13:14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.) that was wounded and yet continued to live had already happened. Ms. Miller said that Jesus Christ had delivered a crushing blow to Satan. When he died on the cross He crushed Satan beneath His feet as was prophecied in

cross He crushed Satan beneath His feet as was prophecied in KJV Genesis 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.The very same Satan who is the power behind the beast! So knowing that many things that are in the bible are cyclical, repeating themselves could this mortal wound that the beast of Revelation receives with the sword possibly be the sword of the Spirit, the Word of God that affects this beast power/governmental system? Could this be the time period where God sends His angel to preach the gospel (KJV Revelation 14:6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people, Or would it fit in the timeframe or scenario of when God will bestow upon the people His grace and supplication? (KJV Zechariah 12:10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn.) Is this the deadly wound delivered to the beast? A period where the truth is delivered and the peoples of the nation rally for awhile but because of various reasons, bad ground, weeds, scorching sum, like in the parable of the sower of the seeds they cave in to the ways of the world system again. Lots of thoughts here and still searching as are the rest you folks so that we can make it all come together in a form that is easily digestable. I imagine we all would like to see it in plain black and white to see the prophecies come about. We're not there yet so we must keep studying! For the benefit of those who wish to read the article that I was reading from Betty Miller the link is below, Peace to all, Robert Link: http://bible.com/bibleanswers_result.php?id=142 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Posted by Charlotte on December 2, 2006, 6:37 pm, in reply to "Searching" Hi Robert, This is very interesting and sounds sensible.

This is very interesting and sounds sensible. We know there are two types of swords spoken of in scripture, one is the tongue, the other is a blade that pierces, or literally cuts. I believe this particular beast was killed, in Hebrew {slain}. The beast was dead, wasn't he? Then in (verse 14) they make an image of the beast, {clone} they give life to the beast or clone. Don't laugh, but I have wondered if the image isn't a clone of a man. We know from verse 17 that this mark will have something to do with buying or selling. Mrs. Miller didn't mention this verse, or I missed it. I wish she had explained what she thought the mark was. I think this is an interesting subject and would like to hear what others think. If the book of Revelation is a revealing book of Jesus Christ, we should be able to come to an understanding of it, through the Holy Spirit of course. Charlotte ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Posted by Tom on December 2, 2006, 7:33 pm, in reply to "Searching" Robert, good topic. Know I know that this is going to be a wild shot in the dark, but....This image that they want to create had a wound by a sword and this image was dead, as I read it. Do we know of someone who had a wound given to him by a sword, who was dead and did live? If we let the Bible interpret the Bible, we could say that this is a description of Christ. What other person is the world more familiar with and might be swayed to worship.? Something to think about. Tom Rev 13:3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death, and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast. Rev 13:14 And deceived them that dwell on the earth, by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast, saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an Image to the beast which had the wound by a sword, and did live. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Posted by Tom on December 3, 2006, 8:03 am, in reply to "Re: Searching" I should have been a little more clear with my thoughts on this subject. I am suggestion that the beast will claim to be Christ. An image depicting Christ would then be in order. A long haired image as He is depicted today. This image is to be created to the beast in his image, not that of Christ. The long haired image will actually be that of Satan. It seems to me that Dr.

that of Christ. The long haired image will actually be that of Satan. It seems to me that Dr. Martin suggested that this could be the case. This seems reasonable to me. Tom

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Posted by Boki on December 2, 2006, 9:20 pm, in reply to "Searching" Robert, I think this will be a literal wound of death. One head is wounded to death but its wound is healed. We have the interpretation of who these heads on the beast are: Here, is the mind that hath wisdom. The seven heads, are, seven mountains, whereupon the woman sitteth; and they are, seven kings: the five, have fallen, the one, is, the other, hath not yet come; and, whensoever he shall come, a little while, must he remain, (Rev 17:9-10 Rotherham) So, these heads are kings. Beast is the eight king and is one of the seven: and the wild-beast which was and is not. And he, is an eighth, and is, of the seven,—and, into destruction, goeth away. (Rev 17:11 Rotherham) Pay attention to this statement: "wild-beast which was and is not". This beast was but is not. We have even more information about it: The wild-beast which thou sawest, was, and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss, and into, destruction, goeth away. And they who are dwelling upon the earth whose name is not written upon the book of life from the foundation of the world, will be astonished, when they see the wild-beast, because it was, and is not, and shall be present. (Rev 17:8 Rotherham) It seems that the fact that the beast was, and is not, but is present again on the scene, is the main thing why people are amazed by this beast. Because beast is the eight king and one of the seven, and it was and is not, but is present again, I think we can identify this wounded head: And I saw one of his heads, showing that it had been slain unto death, and, the stroke of his death, was healed. And the whole earth marveled after the wild-beast, (Rev 13:3 Rotherham) Antichrist is imitating Christ in this way. Jon has corrected me well that this head seems like it was slain to death and I believe that this is a deceivement in which people will believe. They

it was slain to death and I believe that this is a deceivement in which people will believe. They will think that Antichrist was resurrected and we know that only God has power to resurrect someone. How will Antichrist put himself in the prophecies so that people would believe he is Christ? I think that the key are the two witnesses. We know that these witnesses must be killed by the beast and they will be resurrected after three and a half days. But we also know that something similar is to happen to the beast, since its head will be healed. What will Antichrist do? He will accuse the witnesses that they are the beast and the false prophet. I believe that the death wound which the beast will receive will be given by this two witnesses. No one will be allowed to hurt them during their testimony: And, if any one, upon them, chooseth to inflict injury, fire, cometh forth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies; and, if anyone shall choose, upon them, to inflict injury, thus, must he be slain. (Rev 11:5 Rotherham) But, Antichrist will say that he and the false prophet are those two witnesses. But, how will he explain why is the false prophet resurrected too, when only the beast is healed from her wound, while false prophet isn't mentioned at all? He might quote this scripture: So shall it come about that, when any man shall prophesy again, then will his own father and his own mother, of whom he was born, say unto him,—Thou shalt not live! For falsehood hast thou spoken in the name of Yahweh,—So will his own father and his own mother of whom he was born, pierce him through, when he prophesieth, Yea it shall come to pass, in that day, that the prophets, will turn pale, every man by reason of his vision when he prophesieth,—neither will they put on a mantle of hair to deceive. But he will say, No prophet, am I,—One tilling the ground, am I, for, one of the common people, hath owned me from my youth. Then will one say unto him, What are these wounds between thy hands? And he will say, Wherewith I was wounded in the house of them who loved me. (Zec 13:3-6 Rotherham) Antichrist will crucify the witnesses: And their dead bodies lie upon the broadway of the great city, the which is called, spiritually, Sodom and Egypt, where, their Lord also was crucified. (Rev 11:8 Rotherham) The wounds from this Old Testament verse could be given by the crucifixion and that's exactly what Antichrist will claim. He will say that he crucified the beast and the false prophet, but they are deceiving people by living again and that even more proves who they are. Beast is that head living again, while false prophet is that prophet described in Zechariah, with also a deadly wound. As you see, it will be hard to determine who are the real witnesses since they and the beast and the false prophet will have death wounds. I think that thing could be even harder if witnesses crucify the beast and false prophet. We aren't told in which way is

even harder if witnesses crucify the beast and false prophet. We aren't told in which way is that wound given to the beast. This even more complicates the way to determine who are the real witnesses. But, Antichrist will have one big problem-how to prove that one of the two witnesses is Christ, because he will present himself as Christ. How will he do that? By twisting the Scriptures again. I believe he might use this verses to prove that Christ is one of those witnesses: and from—Jesus Christ,—The Faithful Witness, The Firstborn of the Dead, and The Ruler of the Kings of the Earth. Unto him that loveth us, and loosed us out of our sins with his blood,— (Rev 1:5 Rotherham) And, unto the messenger of the assembly, in Laodicea, write:—These things, saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness the beginning of the creation of God: (Rev 3:14 Rotherham) Antichrist might say that these verses show that Christ is the true and faithful witness while the other witness is a man coming in the spirit of Elijah: Lo! I am sending unto you Elijah the prophet,—before the coming of the great and awful day of Yahweh; (Mal 4:5 Rotherham) These are just some of my thoughts how Antichrist might deceive the people into believing that he is Christ.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Posted by Robert on December 4, 2006, 10:28 am, in reply to "Re: Searching" Boki, This beast in Revelations is not an individual. This is a symbol. Have you ever heard of a seven headed human being? I would then reason and think that it is not a literal death but that this wound delivered by the sword is all symbolic language. As Mrs. Miller suggests in her article and as I was trying to get my point across, so is this sword. The sword in scriptures is also known as the Word of God in Eph. 6:17. Difficulties come in deciphering biblical language being used when there is a mixture of the literal with that which is metaphorically symbolic. Sometimes it is difficult to find the dividing line that distinguishes this difference but if we use the principal of going back to the bible and looking up the frequent uses of the word or phrase, we come to a better understanding of the idioms and or the symbology used in scriptures. Thank you Charlotte, Tom, and Boki for your posts, I shall draw from your comments and ponder on them some more,

Peace to all, Robert

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Posted by Boki on December 5, 2006, 11:18 am, in reply to "Re: Searching" Robert, The only interpretation we should rely on are the Scriptures. This is the interpretation of the beast: The wild-beast which thou sawest, was, and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss, and into, destruction, goeth away. And they who are dwelling upon the earth whose name is not written upon the book of life from the foundation of the world, will be astonished, when they see the wild-beast, because it was, and is not, and shall be present. Here, is the mind that hath wisdom. The seven heads, are, seven mountains, whereupon the woman sitteth; and they are, seven kings: the five, have fallen, the one, is, the other, hath not yet come; and, whensoever he shall come, a little while, must he remain, and the wild-beast which was and is not. And he, is an eighth, and is, of the seven,—and, into destruction, goeth away. And, the ten horns which thou sawest, are, ten kings,—who, indeed, have not received, sovereignty, as yet, but, authority, as kings, for one hour, shall receive, with the wild-beast. These, have, one mind, and, their power and authority, unto the wild-beast, they give. (Rev 17:8-13 Rotherham) It's very clear. Seven heads are seven kings, ten horns are ten kings, while the beast itself is the eight one, but one of the seven. I only trust on the interpretation of the Bible and this is its interpretation. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Posted by Jon on December 4, 2006, 7:47 pm, in reply to "Searching" Robert, Here is a Scripture that comes to my mind.

And war broke out in heaven: Michael and his angels fought with the dragon; and the dragon and his angels fought, but they did not prevail, nor was a place found for them in heaven any longer. So the great dragon was cast out, that serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was cast to the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. Then I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, "Now salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of His Christ have come, for the accuser of our brethren, who accused them before our God day and night, has been cast down. And they overcame him by the blood

them before our God day and night, has been cast down. And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony, and they did not love their lives to the death. Therefore rejoice, O heavens, and you who dwell in them! Woe to the inhabitants of the earth and the sea! For the devil has come down to you, having great wrath, because he knows that he has a short time." (Revelation 12:7-12) The saints overcome the dragon by the word of their testimony. They do not overcome the beast, because he is given power over them, but they CAN overcome the demonic power behind the beast. But the question arises when this overcoming will occur. When is Satan cast out of heaven?

Then the seventy returned with joy, saying, "Lord, even the demons are subject to us in Your name." And He said to them, "I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven. Behold, I give you the authority to trample on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy, and nothing shall by any means hurt you. Nevertheless do not rejoice in this, that the spirits are subject to you, but rather rejoice because your names are written in heaven." (Luke 10:17-20) Granted, I believe that Jesus is not seeing something that was actually happening in the spirit at that particular moment, but is foreseeing what will be happening shortly, as he explains in this next passage.

"Now My soul is troubled, and what shall I say? 'Father, save Me from this hour'? But for this purpose I came to this hour. Father, glorify Your name." Then a voice came from heaven, saying, "I have both glorified it and will glorify it again." Therefore the people who stood by and heard it said that it had thundered. Others said, "An angel has spoken to Him." Jesus answered and said, "This voice did not come because of Me, but for your sake. Now is the judgment of this world; now the ruler of this world will be cast out. And I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all peoples to Myself." This He said, signifying by what death He would die. (John 12:27-33) Seems pretty cut and dried. Satan was cast out when Christ's sacrifice was accepted by the Father. I suspect this ties in to my suspicion that the opening of the seven seals began in 30 AD. I don't believe that they have all been opened, but I believe that the first one was most likely opened in 30 AD. Want more proof? Read the description of the sixth seal. It talks about the classic signs that take place before the Day of the Lord. I believe a foreshadowing of the Day of the Lord took

take place before the Day of the Lord. I believe a foreshadowing of the Day of the Lord took place in 70 AD and will happen again. But take a look at the following passage, where Peter speaks of the outpouring of the Holy Spirit at Pentecost:

But this is what was spoken by the prophet Joel: 'And it shall come to pass in the last days, says God, That I will pour out of My Spirit on all flesh; Your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, Your young men shall see visions, Your old men shall dream dreams. And on My menservants and on My maidservants I will pour out My Spirit in those days; And they shall prophesy. I will show wonders in heaven above And signs in the earth beneath: Blood and fire and vapor of smoke. The sun shall be turned into darkness, And the moon into blood, Before the coming of the great and awesome day of the Lord. And it shall come to pass That whoever calls on the name of the Lord Shall be saved.' (Acts 2:16-21) Peter likened the outpouring of the Holy Spirit to Joel's prophecy. Now, I'm not condoning a preterist philosophy, since I believe that there are still many prophecies yet unfulfilled. But I am suggesting we all think a little outside the box of what we've been taught. Perhaps the timing of certain events is not yet future, but in our past. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Posted by Charlotte on December 4, 2006, 8:15 pm, in reply to "Re: Searching" Hi Jon, I have wondered whether some of the prophecies haven't already been fulfilled. Jon wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Jesus answered and said, "This voice did not come because of Me, but for your sake. Now is the judgment of this world; now the ruler of this world will be cast out. And I, if I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all peoples to Myself." This He said, signifying by what death He would die. (John 12:27-33) <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< When I read (verse 31) something jumped out at me. Notice what it says. "NOW is the judgment of this world. NOW is the prince of this world be cast out." If Christ died for the world and all sins have been blotted out why will anyone still be judged? Weren't we all judged when Christ was judged, just like we died when he died? Just some thoughts. Charlotte ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Posted by Jon on December 4, 2006, 8:21 pm, in reply to "Re: Searching" Charlotte, That's a great question. I looked up this verse in the Young's Literal Translation just now, because he tends to be very literal when it comes to verb tenses and articles (a, an and the). He translated Jesus as saying, "Now is A judgment of the world." It was not the final judgment, because the White Throne Judgment has yet to come. But it was A judgment on the world nonetheless. But the White Throne Judgment is THE judgment of the world--the big one. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Posted by Robert on December 5, 2006, 3:56 pm, in reply to "Re: Searching" Boki, Perhaps I have not brought my point across to you and everyone else. If you would believe scriptures and not me, how about these scriptures here: KJV Daniel 7:17 These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth. KJV Daniel 7:23 Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces. It plainly states in each verse that a beast may be a king or a kingdom and is not always a literal beast. So am I so far off if I say I think that the beast power may be the existing government or kingdom? My point is that there are certain words that are used as symbols. Beast is one such word. I try to use the Word of God just as you do, to try to show everyone where I am coming from. Hope this got my point across, Peace to you brother,

Peace to you brother, Robert ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Posted by Tom on December 5, 2006, 4:25 pm, in reply to "Re: Searching" Robert, I understand and agree with you. Tom ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Posted by Boki on December 5, 2006, 7:42 pm, in reply to "Re: Searching" Robert, We must use the interpretation from the Revelation. These beasts from Daniel aren't the same beasts. Three horns are uprooted by the little horn, while in Revelation ten horns stay until the second advent of Christ, to fight with Him. Then, in Revelation, the beast whose body parts consist only of the first three beasts from Daniel is thrown into the lake fire, while in Daniel only the fourth one is thrown, while other three ones are spared: I continued looking, then because of the sound of the great words which the horn was speaking, I continued looking, until that the wild beast, was slain, and his body destroyed, and given to the burning of the fire. As concerning the rest of the beasts, their dominion, was taken away,—but, a lengthening of life, was given to them, until time and season. (Dan 7:11-12 Rotherham) And the most important thing, when Jesus arrives on clouds, He is brought before Yahweh, and we know that Yahweh won't come down to Earth before the end of Millennium: I continued looking in the visions of the night, when lo! with the clouds of the heavens, one like a son of man, was coming,—and, unto the Ancient of days, he approached, and, before him, they brought him near; (Dan 7:13 Rotherham) Compare these verses: I continued looking, until that, thrones, were placed, and, the Ancient of days, took his seat,— whose, garment, like snow, was white, and, the hair of his head, like pure wool, his throne, was flames of fire, his wheels, a burning fire. A stream of fire, was flowing on and issuing forth from before him, a thousand thousand, waited upon him and, ten thousand times ten thousand, before him, stood up,—Judgment, took its seat, and, books, were opened. (Dan 7:9-10 Rotherham) And I saw a great white throne, and him that was sitting thereon, from whose face fled the

And I saw a great white throne, and him that was sitting thereon, from whose face fled the earth and heaven, and, place, was not found for them. And I saw the dead, the great and the small, standing before the throne; and, books, were opened, and, another book, was opened, which is, the book, of life; and the dead, were judged, out of the things written in the books, according to their works. (Rev 20:11-12 Rotherham) As we have the identification of those ten horns from Revelation in Psalm 83, we also have the identity of this seven horns from Daniel 7 and also of the little horn: and say: Thus saith the Lord GOD: Behold, I am against thee, O Gog, chief prince of Meshech and Tubal; and I will turn thee about, and put hooks into thy jaws, and I will bring thee forth, and all thine army, horses and horsemen, all of them clothed most gorgeously, a great company with buckler and shield, all of them handling swords: Persia, Cush, and Put with them, all of them with shield and helmet; Gomer, and all his bands; the house of Togarmah in the uttermost parts of the north, and all his bands; even many peoples with thee. (Eze 38:3-6 JPS) Gog is the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal. These are the two horns of the beast. Other five are Persia, Cush, Put, Gomer and Togarmah. Two followers of this little horn are identified in Daniel 11: But he shall have power over the treasures of gold and silver, and over all the precious things of Egypt; and the Libyans and the Ethiopians shall be at his steps. (Dan 11:43 JPS) Cush is by scholars identified with Ethiopia and in most cases Put is identified with Lybia. So we have even here two horns identified, and, I believe, also those three uprooted horns: He shall enter also into the beauteous land, and many countries shall be overthrown; but these shall be delivered out of his hand, Edom, and Moab, and the chief of the children of Ammon. (Dan 11:41 JPS) Little horn humbles these three horns, they are uprooted and not anymore the part of the fourth beast, the fourth kingdom. After that, they are some kind of safe place from this evil ruler. This attack of Gog is described in Revelation and it is definitely occurring after Millennium: And, as soon as the thousand years, shall be ended, the Accuser shall be loosed out of his prison, and will go forth to deceive the nations that are in the four corners of the earth, the Gog and Magog, to gather them together unto the battle—the number of whom, is as the sand of the sea. And they came up over the breadth of the land, and surrounded the camp of the saints, and the beloved city. And there came down fire out of heaven, and devoured them; and, the Adversary that had been deceiving them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone,

the Adversary that had been deceiving them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where were both the wild-beast and the false-prophet; and they shall be tormented, day and night, unto the ages of ages. (Rev 20:7-10 Rotherham) Most of the Book of Daniel is some kind of apocalypse for after Millennium, as Revelation is for the end of this age. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Posted by Robert on December 5, 2006, 4:40 pm, in reply to "Re: Searching" Jon, I would agree with you if what you are saying is that certain things that happened in times past were a foreshadow of those things that will happen in the future. There are certain biblical events that will be repeated, no doubt in my mind. As far as the first seal being opened already by Christ I would ask you how you arrived at your understanding. And secondly how do you interpret that verse? Thirdly, I just reread the scripture in Revelation about the sixth seal and I don't see that which happened in 70 A.D. as a foreshadow of what the Day of the Lord will be. I think that the Day of the Lord is one of those things in the bible that will be a onetime event. There are many events associated with the Day of the Lord and just to pick one, "every mountain and island were moved out of their places (Rev.6:14)." This did not occur in 70 AD nor anything to resemble it. I would that you carry your idea a bit further so that we can be enlightened. Until then, Peace to you brother, Robert ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~