Mdn Mind Storms Iii

Vol. III

Marathi.Net Mind Storms

Marathi.Net

Mind Storms Volume III

PDF Compiled & Created By Gautam Soman For Marathi.Net http://groups.yahoo.com/group/marathidtnet

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Dear All, Welcome to third edition of Mind Storms! Mind Storms is a collection of some of the interesting debates and discussions held at our Yahoo! Group, the Marathi.Net. This volume contains following 12 debates. A matter of manners ............................................................................................ 3 Should President Kalam have had a second term?......................................................... 6 Need Suggestion from you all ................................................................................. 8 Next Prez... .................................................................................................... 12 Media and the Virginia University murders ............................................................... 17 Kolhapuri Pandhara Rassa.............................................................. 19 Do they really deserve this? ................................................................................. 21 My Haiku: The Great Indian Game Show .................................................................. 25 Rave Party - Pune ............................................................................................. 26 We Desi parents are too competitive ...................................................................... 33 Tamilnadu-madhil Marathi manasathi ..................................................................... 40 India - China - Maharastra ................................................................................... 43

The selection of these debates was a personal choice, and I hope to have done justice to it, in terms of contents and interest-level. No change has been made to the contents, except a rudimentary spell-check, and some formatting to make the text more readable. A disclaimer: the views and opinions presented here belong to the respective contributors, and they should not be taken as collective mindset of Marathi.Net group as a whole. You may wonder what purpose such a compilation serves. The benefits are manifold. 1. Not many of us would browse through message-archives to read upon past stuff. However, to have a compilation like this makes us at least take a glance. 2. Message archives are accessible only to group-members. This document is something that you can share with your friends. 3. Creating this document is itself something of a joy. It makes me take a ride down the memory-lane and re-live those past months once again. Do go through this document. Am sure once you begin reading, you will not close it until you have been through it completely. A genuine Thank-You to all whose names feature in pages to follow. You make Marathi.Net a place worth being a part of. Keep writing, keep arguing. Yours, Gautam For Team MdN 18Th June 2007.

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A matter of manners Hi, It was late evening and we were discussing something. Just then, an office boy entered with a tray of hot steaming teacups. As I gleefully picked up one, I said, "Thank You!" After the boy left, a colleague commented, " Thank you kyon bola re? Uska to kaam hi hai wo. Kal ko agar teri wife tumhe chaai laa ke de to usse bhi thank you bolega kya tu?" We all laughed, and the matter ended there. Now as I think about it, there are a couple of points I wish to note. 1. Is it necessary to express gratitude if someone does what he/she is supposed to do? There is a tendency that we should not thank one who is being paid for the job. Somehow, I feel that saying “thanks”, “please” is something that is basic human courtesy and has nothing to do with whether is person is being paid for it or not. In fact, I often find myself saying "Thank you" to the waiters in hotel, and have been chided for it. 2. What is wrong in saying thank you to wife for bringing a cup of tea? If she does it without asking for it, she is being sensitive to my needs and hence deserves the thanks. If she brings it because I asked for it, again she is respecting a request, and hence again deserves the thanks! 3. Even in today's day and age, cooking is still supposed to be a domain of women. Another incident: a colleague had invited me to his house for a chat after we left office for the day. As he opened the door to his house, he said, " aapaN gappa maarat basoo thoDaa weL. Hee yeilach yevDhyaat aaNi chahaa vagaire karel." (Let’s sit and chat for a while. My wife will return soon from office, and she will prepare some tea-snacks.) I couldn't suppress a smile to hear this comment from a guy who often brags about his cooking skills, ha ha! -G. Good Morning, Hey gautam, very nice topic, i totally agree with you. I feel, though a person is doing his work, if you thank him, he will feel encouraged and will do a better job next time. Thanking someone for their job, shows them how much you value and appreciate them and their sense of duty. Specially people like chai wala and waiters, for whom we cant do much, to improve their financial state, even if we thank them, it will atleast bring a smile to their face. Even at home, certain things are taken for granted like the women are supposed to look after all the needs and requirements of the house. And Ironically this mentality has been imbibed by the women, themselves. Geeta Kharbe

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Hi Gautam, I find out this very interesting. Ya, some ppls dont like to be so formal as in case of your friend who is telling you "about service a tea by your wife..." Even you go to the hotel, after paying your bill , the waiter does says "Thank you", . He could walk stright a way by not saying anything. but his manners & ethics tell him to say "Thanks". I would like to point out here that , By saying it we are showing respect to his work & vice versa. Parag Diwan

Hey G, My opinion regarding this is slightly different. Let me tell my experiences. When I got married, I have to tell my husband not to say "Thank You" for everything I do for him. I always felt awkard or as if I am doing great favers on somebody. Also, I felt that it is a kind of insult to my love expressed through that act for him. Same thing I experienced when my in-laws visited us. I felt it too much. Whenever I hear a thank you........from close people I feel as if they are insulting me and my love for them. Instead I nod my head or sometimes wave my hand or facial expressions to express my gratitude or even thanks. I feel this as more natural than to say thanks all the time. This is Indian way of expressions. "Thanks" is a kind of formal expression........a BRITISH way. If you go in England, you will find people using many words often like thank you, lovely, great, excellent, dear..and I found that many times the meaning of those becomes diluted by using them often. Many times people just use many of these words mechanically. There is no emotional touch to those words.........Sometimes they might be genuine or encouraging but not all the time. Pan Mhanatat Na........"Aati tithe Maati". If it is genuine then why they celebrate "THANKS GIVING DAY" separately??? However, I don't mind to say thanks to the tea boy or to a person to whom we are paying for his/her work. We must express our gratitude or thanks by any means to atleast people who are not very close to us. By the way....."THANKS' for the topic. Aparna

Yes i agree with Mrs. Aparna Thnax is for strangers whom u donn know.... But not for the people we ,know , who are close. Because there is no value we can set for love , so thanx might be little insulting their love which might be a crime in some ppl's eyes an way of thinking... Naveen mudhole

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Hi, after having read many mails on this topic, i wud also like to say something. I really think, it is a matter of manners, in fact of politeness. By saying thanks one is shoing respect to the other person, whether close to u or a strange person. I live in germany and ppl here say all the time thanks, it is also a "reciept" that someone has done something for u. One says just thanks or also smile along with that, to show ones feelings. If we go to a shop or a restaurent, we always order whatever we need with "please" hanging to it, and if we get the thing from the shopkeeper She / he gives that with the words "Bitte". I observe one thing here. when i watch ppl from india, especially on a visit, they just pay the product in the shop and go away, here it is taken ill. I have even watched in one restaurent, the waiter making a strange face, coz the guest did not say "please" after having ordered tee or whatever, and then said,"please, please Mr." OK. this behaviour of the waiter was also not very friendly, but the atmosphear was disturbed. So, where is harm in saying please or thanks? When one enters here a shop one always says Good Morning or whatever is appropriate, when leaving the shop, one says good bye. In a supermerket, after u pay ur purchase, the cashier alsways say "I wish u a good day". When i come to india and just walk in or out of a shop, i feel something is missing. I say Namaste, and then the shopkeeper is amazed. If we are entering a shop, we r entering a territory not belonging to us and it is according to me a must to say hallo or namaste or a similar thing. I feel it is not just a matter of manners but also a a matter of politeness. I know, in india we "say sorry" (it is a movement of hands) if we touch something with our feet. That also, in my opinion, is a way of showing respect even to a thing. Why then not show respect to a person? Beste weshes Nalini hi Putting in my 2 cents. I am not very comfortable with "Thank you" business in the home. But really have no choice, it seems our children will get used to saying "Thank you", only if they hear us saying "Thank you" all the time. Otherwise "gharabaher mule ijjat kadhatat". So we do say thank you to each -other. regards harsh

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Should President Kalam have had a second term? President Kalam came to focus first as India's rocket man. An immensely talented and balanced individual together with his love for children, he has almost become the second "Chacha Nehru" for India. We have been very impressed with his impressive yet practical speeches aimed at today's youth in particular and the country in general. The most effective one was the speech he made at Hyderabad in which he listed his three visions for India. But he is just that - a scientist. A scientist, an actor, or any such person does not necessarily be a good leader and Mr. Kalam's decisions as a President have shown that he is one of the worst Presidents we've had so far. Just because he is very popular does not make him a good President. His views on the death penalty and the time he is taking to dismiss the mercy plea by the certified terrorist Afzal Guru, who as we all know was one of the insurgents who attacked the Parliament, shows that is incapable of carrying out his duties as a President. Regarding the death penalty, if the fear of death goes out of the criminal mind, then he will not hesitate even to commit the most gruesome mass murders and get away with it because there is no death penalty. If one wants to kill somebody and going to jail for the rest of his or her life as a result is acceptable to an individual, than knowing that there is no death sentence, that individual will go ahead with the murder "fearlessly". Agreed that the President has to consult a number of people and follow certain procedures when there is a sensitive matter like the Afzal Guru death sentence, but since when did executing a terrorist become "sensitive" in the first place? Why is he taking such a long time just to sign a piece of paper dismissing his mercy plea. This is a big slap in the face of the family, relatives, and friends of those security personnel killed in the attack and also a huge insult of the martyrs themselves. That shows his immaturity as a President. It is good that they returned the medals given to them. Forgive and forget is a policy that was fatally detrimental to the pre-British era India, and it will be so to present India waiting to surge ahead as a World Power. I believe that a person, whether a terrorist or not, when committing an act knows that the end result will be the death of one or more individuals - does not deserve to live in this world. One cannot commit murder and then sit comfortably in some jail in India living his life and eating for free at the taxpayer's expense when the kith and kin of those killed are permanently affected and in some instances, the national security is jeopardised. The death penalty cannot be scrapped under the pretext of stopping 'murder in the name of justice'. Mr. Kalaam has expressed his wish to be a teacher after he ends his term as President, let him do that. Let him be what he is or what our country needs - a teacher, scientist at best as a social worker - but please not as a President. So friends, if you receive emails asking to vote for him - you know what to do. - Mandar D Joshi

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hi "Afzal Guru, who as we all know was one of the insurgents who attacked the Parliament" Afzal guru was not among the insurgents who attacked the parliament. He is a political activist. This situation can be equated with Savarkar being charged with the conspiracy to assassinate Mahatma Gandhi. Did Savarkar play any direct part - no, did he asked Godse to assassinate Gandhi - no, was he the spiritual leader of Godse - yes, did he play any part at all in forming Godse's mindset - yes, so should he be hanged? - of course not. So would you advocate hanging Lalkirshna Advani for Mumbai riots/Godhra riots? After all, he is in a way responsible for changing the Hindu mindset. I am just wondering if we are advocating same set of rules for everyone! That is what exactly the complaint is in this case. This is a person who is at the best very remotely connected with the attack on Indian parliament. 10-20 years jail term may be justified but death by hanging? absolutely not. *s*Now do not start arguing that if we put him in jail then there is a wave of kidnapping. It still does not justify hanging. regards harsh Dear friends, It is Law machinery to decide for prosecution of Mr. L.K. Adwani or anyone as per the provisions of law. It's not as per like or dislike of anybody to prosecute him or not. If he faces law trials in end gets death penalty then he should be hanged to death without any hitch. It's not because Mr. Afzal Guru is a Muslim, I fully agree recommend for his execution. It's only because hon'ble Supreme court’s verdict for him by well analysing his deeds on the basis of prevailing laws. So Mr. Afzal Guru should be hanged to death immediately without further delay any slightest hitch as when law orders for his actual execution. Deepak S.Talwalker

http://justiceforafzalguru.org/ There are tones of articles on the site, certainly worth reading if anyone is interested in Afzal Guru case. Unfortunately, there are no factual articles that call for the execution. What one sees mostly are emotional outbursts. I am trying to confirm the following but have not come across anything. Is there any law student in this group? I need to know if the transcripts can be read online. In its judgment on August 5 2005, the supreme court admitted that the evidence against Afzal was only circumstantial, and that there was no evidence that he belonged to any terrorist group or organisation. But it went on to endorse what can only be described as lynch law. "The incident, which resulted in heavy casualties, had shaken the entire nation," it said, "and the collective conscience of the society will only be satisfied if capital punishment is awarded to the offender." regards harsh

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Need Suggestion from you all Hi All, I need suggestion from you all regarding below matter. Recently my neighbor had built unauthorized construction [Non RAC] on his terrace of four rooms . When we also tried to build just one room on terrace then we got notice from Pune corporation that this is not allowed and construction needs to be stopped. Now my neighbour is having political big leader link also his brother is working in Police dept so they are allowed to do all unauthorized things ,,also pune corporation is not at all giving them notice or taking any action against then for unauthorized construction. My point is that if we are not allowed to construct without corporation permission then even other people also should not allowed to do so. Rule should be equal to all. Even when we pointed this to corporation, they just ignored it. Why still then my neighbor didn’t get notice or objection from government. Why rules are not equal to all. I want to know your opinion, Should I take help of news channel get right Justice. If yes then how I should do, what all points I need to know for this . I really wanna fight against such matter. Why every time normal people have to suffer and obey rules?. Political people and police dept have permission to do anything?????????? Smita Hi Smita, This is the way things work in India. Is your concern about building your house extension without permission or the corporate not taking action against your neighbour? If you want to build your extension without permission, simplest thing I would do is make good relations with the neighbour. Tell him that you got a notice and corporation people are planning to send him one too and let him pressurise the corporation people not to send him one and not act on the one sent to you. If you want to build your extension with permission from corporation I think that the simplest thing. You need 3-4 days but you can get the permission within 3 weeks. At most, you need to spare 1000 rupees. The last difficult option is : Build some structure that can be on line borderlines of permanent or temporary. So it will be always doubtful if you need permission from corporation or not. Once you are sure that it’s a doubtful case you can them make it an issue in press or media. Then you can site your neighbour's construction to media and say if this doesn't need permission why do I need. I appreciate your concern of different treatment to different people, but some things needs to be handled tactically, so be careful. Hope this helps, Regards, Ashutosh http://groups.yahoo.com/group/marathidtnet

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Hi Ashutosh, Thanks for the reply. I agree to your point that things need to be handled tactically. we were planning to do construction within 3-4 days itself and finished it ASAP. but just after 2 days we got notice so I am doubtful that neibhour himself must have told corporation regarding this ... may be , not sure... Smita

hi Smitha First thing you need to do is stop your illegal work. that’s stop construction. we need to be firstly all clear to fight against such matters.. secondly you just write a letter to corporation about the ill legal construction going on.( Be prepared for the consequences because your neighbour may try to trouble you.) and there will same sentences like " tuzya potamadhe ka dukhata" Then write again one more letter for follow up if corporation is not doing anything.. then go to media with the dates of two letters and letters as well... and then only corporation will take any action.. Chandrasekhar Shrikhande

Hi Smitha.. I think the option suggested earlier by Ashutosh was much more FEASIBLE.. You have mentioned that your neighbour has strong political relations and his brother is in Police Services. The consequences in this case, can be much much severe than one can imagine. The most feasible option, hence, is make good relations, arrange some moolah...and get the work approved. but do remember one thing, times change, situations change, it might be possible for you right now to do this illegal construction by STUFFING money. But who know what the situation gonna be after 10 years...??? So the best options, FIND A LEGAL way of doing it. Thanks Abhijit Hey Smitha... I have an idea. If you know anyone from local newspaper, feed them. They love these kinds of stories. And try to do it anonymously. The chances that they have to bring that construction down are more. I cannot advice you for way to build the unauthorized construction for yourself but at least you can enjoy the "Equality" Take care. Thanks and Regards Hrishikesh Kolhatkar

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hi Smita, I think you should not go with that political leader and make good relations with him. he'll turn his back any time when you need REAL support...ok! Police are one community whom I'll never trust in my lifetime....I've had so many bad exp with them. Coming to the point....if you're planning to launch a complaint. do it and further most IMP thing... get a form of RIGHT TO INFORMATION ACT which is available for 10 Rs. (sorry don't know where!) Get it filled, get it signed while you're launching complaint. and hand over a copy of complaint and form to Media. Listen, this is worst way to do...but once police and municipal corp. know that RTI has been dispatched for this complaint...they'll never hesitate to take action. once they'll help leader and they'll get kicked off from Govt job. Sorry, nobody has mentioned about this, so I thought to... Final decision is yours, be in law and force people to be in law rather than to share illegal meat ! bye... Regards, Manoj Hi Smita, If you do not find any option, you can discuss the matter with the pune municipal commissioner rather the building permission department. You can get his appointment as well as contact no. from the website. Hello Smita, Are you sure that your neighbours have not got any permission? Also, just find out through the corporation or any real estate agent the conditions of construction in your area. To speak against something (especially illegal) we need to have a couple of things. 1) Strong determination to fight against any injustice (it helps) 2) Thorough knowledge of legal conditions and situations (or some person in contact who has this knowledge) 3) Complete knowledge of your property construction papers 4) If possible take photographs of the illegal construction that your neighbour had done. After having all these you will be ready to fight against it. Try to proceed legally ........Go to corporation personally and talk to the officer there. Have faith that not all are corrupted. Keep records of your meetings with the person. Even you can secretly record the conversation (it will help you in final move when you have to go into the media). Be careful while using language and be strategic.

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If your neighbour has political contacts and some, relative in police it doesn't mean that you start buttering them. You should find out about the corporator in your area......which political party s/he belongs. If your neighbour also has same political party contact....try to talk with the corporator about the construction problem (why you want to construct the room......please avoid saying negative things like why he is permitted and why I am given a notice). If s/he will not listen then go to some opposite political party person who has lost election by less margin. S/he might help you due to political reasons. You should have courage to go to directly to the commissioner of Police or even Mr. Pravin Paradeshi. (Keep notes of all the conversations). I am sure somebody will listen as not all are corrupted. Even if nothing will happen then you go to the media with all the evidences. Now to do all these things you have to invest much time and money. You must compare your desire to fight against injustice and your willingness/availability to spend your time and money. That is if you feel everything is in proportion or worthy to do then go ahead with determination to win. Otherwise, you can do how other citizens are doing that is kept quiet. I hope it will be helpful. If I used some harsh words.....then I am sorry for that. Aparna Hey hi!! Namskar!! Jar tumhala pan construction karaychi (illegal) permission deli geli aste tar.. tuzi news dusraya koni channel war dili asti. Aani mag tu hey mail naste lihile. Tyapeksha aahe te thik aahe. Ardhavat constuctionwar kundhya vaigre theun.. vel sod..taripan chaan disel. Varsha Smita, Mala vattatay tula je vattata te yogyach aahe. Ani jar tujyakade hi fight dyayla vel and josh asel tar tu nakkich dyayla hava. Tujya babtit kay jhala ani tu kay kela asta hya saglya nirarthak goshti aahet. Sagla bhastachar mulat suru hoto karan apan nimut pane baghto. tula aaj awaz uthvalva sa vatatoy karan he illigal kaam tula karne shakya jhale nahi. ani mhanun tu ankhi kunala hi karun dyayla tayar nahis. So that good..hich tar suruvat aahe... jevha ekemekana aapan chukichya margavarun janyas adavu tevhach kahi tari karu shaku. Dole banda karun magomag chalnarya Mendya kiva ekmekache pay khechnare Khekade he donhi eka babtit changel aahet Yogya marga varun janasathi "just folllow" ani vayeet marga sathi "Pull back that fellow" And to contact News channels just visit there site. Regards, Vishal Galvankar

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Next Prez... Hi, Well, with the Dr APJ Abdul Kalam's tenure drawing to a close, the debate seems to be heating up on who would occupy his palatial residence, the Rashtrapati Bhavan.. 1. Has Kalam expressed any desire to be in running for a second term? IMO, he deserves one.. 2. If not Kalam, who others are already in the fray? I heard Jyoti Basu has been nominated by the Left, and Veerappa Moily is gunning for the same as well. 3. Without meaning to be regionally biased, is there any Marathi person being considered? -G.

Hi G, Well, regarding the highest post of Indian republic that is "The President".....you said a realistic truth initially. I mean, this post has become just a means of occupying the palatial residence for five years and being honorable guest in many events national as well as international. In India (sadly) President has no authority (not theoretically but practically and realistically) to make any difference in Indian political situations and events(In the case of punishment given to Afjal he could not take any decision on his own). Because political parties who support any candidate want him/her to be a puppet in their hands and not to be an individual Indian. Because Dr Kalam did not allow Sonia to be PM (though it was exhibited that Sonia herself denied it) Congress doesn't want him again. For similar kind of reasons (his style of expressing his own views openly) may be BJP is not interested in him anymore. All political parties just want their own candidate and Mr. Narayan Murthy will not be ready to be a puppet. So according to my view it is not up to us (we Indian citizens) to choose our own President but we have to accept these political adjustments. I don't find any point in discussing about this on the grounds of Marathi and non-Marathi because it is not the question of Maharashtra but whole India. Ma. Yashvantrao Chavan could achieve such status because of his own personality. Frankly speaking, I don't find any such influential Maharashtrian personality to achieve this post in any political party. Mr. Sharad Pawar is fine for the post of PM and for President post he has to go miles away.....miles away. Why don't people understand .......these issues like Marathi and nonMarathi are political stunts to divide people’s votes. During my school age whenever I read in civics about our Presidents and even now, I read the list, it never comes in my mind that well so and so President was Bihari or Sikh or Muslim or Maharashtrian or Bengali. They are just honorable names for me. I this style of politically motivated selection style of president have started by Mrs. Indira Gandhi and still it is continued. It will not make any difference to US even if anybody will become president........whether a Marathi or non-Marathi. Thanks Aparna

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Hi Aparna, Nice to see such a detailed response to my post! To continue on this topic... Is it a requirement by law to have a aged president? The Constitution requires a candidate to be minimum 35 years of age... but does it also require him/her to be above 60 years? There was some talk about Mr. Narayan Murthy being offered the post of head of the state, and if am not mistaken Dr Kalam was also supposed to be in favour of Mr. Murthy as his worthy successor. What happened to it? Nobody has asked for MY opinion, but if anyone does, I would say am not too excited about any of the politicos being considered... I wish to see someone from corporate or academic world... someone a bit young, dynamic and charismatic... how about an Indian "John F Kennedy" ? -G.

Hey G, I think to be a president of India there is no such requirement that the candidate should be aged one. Normally, it is the highest and honarable post in India (the first citizen of India) it is obviously accepted (nowadays) that a person might be of old age. Firstly, if the person will be young and dashing (above 35) s/he will not listen to all these aged politicians or one might not get such an influential personality who will be accepted by all the parties and is capable of acquiring the highest post. Secondly, for all political parties it is convenient to have an aged person as a president so that s/he will be engaged in his health problems more and will keep quiet for most of the times. It is quite interesting to think about this as if we see list of our previous presidents they were experts in their own fields and they were active. e.g. Dr Rajendra Prasad our first president.......he seemed to be young.....even Dr C.V. Raman, Sri V. V. Giri. Now somebody (politically motivated) can also argue that all these are from Brahmin class. Even recently, I heard that we should not celebrate 5th September as Teacher's day because it is Dr Raman's birthday and he has nothing to do with education. It should be Sawitribai Phule's birthday. This is another issue but I just happened to mention it to show the style of arguments in our SECULAR (pseudo) India. I do remember that during the president ship of Dr Zhel Singh. Indira Gandhi never offered him the respect of president. Even once, she gave speech on 26th January from Red Fort that is actually the republican right of The President of India. So my arguments remains the same that there is no use of our discussion but it will be a great disappointment to discuss about our own choice. Unfortunately Indian citizens have no right to vote for Indian President's post otherwise the dirty politics started by Mrs. Gandhi (Indira not Sonia......but continued by her) in the selection process would have been disappeared. Once again many thanks Aparna

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Hi Aparna, One small correction: You seem to be confused between S. Radhakrishnan and C.V. Raman. S. Radhakrishnan was our second president and its his birthday that we celebrate as teacher's day.. And greed he was equally expert in his field. C.V. Raman is the Novel Laureate famous from Raman Effect. Rahul Well G, it just appeared in my mind that in the history of the Presidentship of India no woman has become a president. Why it is so........I did not understand. Is it the reflection of our culture that nobody wants a woman to be at the highest post of Indian Republic? What about Mrs. Sudha Murthy?

Hi All, President was one of the brilliant stroke of people who framed our constitution. He does not have much authority during normal times, but the President is one crucial part of the checks and balances installed by constitution to avoid excessive misuse of the authority. He is the chief of army (I am not sure though, my civics was always weak). All the rules passed by Legislature (MP's) have to be signed by the President. There is something similar about the Justice department also. So basically, he is a nominal power who in principle can keep other people in check while he himself cannot do much. Only because of the president post, we haven’t had any Military takeover's (unlike Pakistan) and only one emergency (for which Indira Gandhi had to struggle a lot). Just for clarification. Rahul

Yes. Mr.Sushilkumar Shinde is most accepted candidate. 1st he is non-controversial personality. 2nd he will get support from UP i.e. Mayavati due to his backward class background and for the same reason BJP and their allies are unlikely to oppose him. He was never involved in any scams even being a chief minister a central minister and even as Governor. Vishwas kalyankar

Dear Vishwas We want non-Political person as our president. However, whether Mr. Shinde is controversial or not is not important and frankly speaking, he won't deserve to be "President of India". Till now, we had highly qualified and well respected people as our president. So please don't even think/talk abt Mr. shinde kyonki diwaro ke (mails ke bhi) kan hote hai. Rather even if we discussed and found the best candidate here in Debate, its not goning make any change :)

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In my opinion, People who regularly cast their vote at the time of general elections(even at muncipal level) can only debate on any polls at internet. nusate ekane tukada takayacha aani bakichyani chaghalat basayacha kharach kahihi upyog hoto??? or jyana fukat internet aahe aani vel jat nahi or bharata baher basun ethalya issues baddal uhapoh karat basayacha. kharach ground reality var kuni kam kele aahe ka?? discuss karanyaryane swathachya kutumba sodun dusarya sathi kahi kele aahe ka? or dusarya kunachya garib mulache shikshanasathi madad keli aahe ka?? aashya konatyahi prakare kuni kary karat aasel tar me vel kadun madat karayala tayar aahe. Hospital madhe kahi patient javal kunich nasate tya thikani aapalya paiki vel dila aahe ka??? kharach aasale upkram suru karu aani samajik kary karu....nako fukat internet vaifal charcha..... Aayushyat dusare barech kahi aahe karanya sarakhe. kunala maza raag aala aasel tar mafi aasavi. pan ek kalkalichi vinanti kasavashi vatali mhanun me ti keli. kahi vakye chukali aasatil/ dukhavanari aasatil pan tya var charcha n karata garbhit arth samazala aasel tar aapan ekatra kahi tari karu. Rahul bokil

priya rahul! sasneh namaskar. aaple rashtrapati kon asavet ya prashnachya nimittane tuzya lekhanatun vyakt zaleli bhavana khup mahatvachi vatli. matadanachya rashtriya kartavyat kasur karanaryana khare tar rashtriya gunhegar manayala have,karan tyanchya tya audasinyamule deshachya rajkaranabarobarine samajstithivarhi anuchit parinam hoto,tyache dayitva tyanchyavarch takayala have. tuza dusara muddahi mahatvapurna vatla. ya madhyamatun keval charcha hot rahte tyaaivaji aapan aplya samajasathi kay karu shaku yacha vichar hovun to pratyaksh krutit utarava hi apeksha/suchana yogya ahe. mi sanghacha(rss) karyakarta ahe ani tya preranetunach anek samajhitachya upakramat sakriy sahbhag gheto. samajavishayichya talmalitun lihilele tuze vichar avadale mhanun ha patraprapanch ! Pramod Bapat

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Friends, No way. Well, thanks to Dr.Kalam for his services. I feel sorry for those people who can't think any other equally qualified individual. Any way President of India is not a position of power. It is used to honor services of highly qualified individuals towards the nation. K.R. Narayanan played even better role than Kalam in terms of External Affairs. So, its unfair that the if someone is getting a repetitive term. There are hundreds of equally/ may be individuals that are more qualified. E.g. Ex Mah Governor P.C. Alexander. (Was in race last time). Thanks & regards, Shrirang Joshi

Hi friends, Obviously, prez's post is the most respected post of India and I can see that most of us are of the agreeable opinion that the prez shouldn't be a puppet in the hands of any political party. So, if Mr. Sushilkumar Shinde takes the post , then he will favour congress. And about Mr. Narayan Murthy, he is a man of huge capability and vision. He is a proven corporate tycoon and is a quite influential personality. He is progressive, futuristic, and modern. He is a self-made personality with the capability of honouring this highest post and putting it to good use. So, my two cents are, Mr. Narayan Murthy is visibly the most appropriate candidate of all. Best regards, Priya Parab

Aapala Rashtrapati mhanun konhi tya T N Sheshan la Shodhun Aanel kare ? toch khara hya padala nyay deu shakel

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Media and the Virginia University murders Hi Once more, the restraint of the BBC and other western media when reporting a tragedy has been revealed. I have seen the news about the murders at Virginia Tech University on TV at least five to six times, but I've not seen - even a single time - gory scenes, bodies lying around and reporters shouting at the top of their voices as if their salary might be deducted if they don't. Instead, what was seen was a very dignified reporting. A This is one good thing that we can very well afford to ape from the western world. Compare that with the 11-July bomb blasts in the Western Railway suburban trains. Our media was showing broken limbs, bloody compartments, severed heads, and what not over and over again. I got the feeling as if I was watching some low-grade Hollywood carnage movie. Best Regards, Mandar

The problem is that they are learning the wrong things from the western media.. like hyping up small things like Ash-Abhishek marriage.. (Remember the hype, which Diana received.., both during and after marriage).. RV

very true........there’s a lot to learn from the western media............and our media can build up on its class by that................. Geeta kharbe

And the names too are catchy:"Gere tune kya kiya" - Aaj Tak "Kiss ka Kasur" - Zee News And they dedicate 30 min to 1 hr episode for such news, repeating the footage million times at a stretch. Amit Rajput

I think we are (Indian people) also responsible in some ways for such cheap publicity stunts. It has been always true that Indian people encourage cheap publicity stunts by gathering around to watch (if it is on street) or by watching the media. Why we cannot ban these channels for some days to show such cheap publicity slogans and stunts. Same http://groups.yahoo.com/group/marathidtnet

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thing had happened when a college professor's love affair was revealed by his wife and it was shown that she was badly beating the professor and the girl. We learn wrong things from the west all the time ignoring good things like social and civic awareness, cleanliness, habit of preserving old monuments and having very good libraries all over the cities as well as towns. Just shouting about western influence on Indian culture is not going to help anymore......people really have to introspect. Aparna Hey hi!! Aaj "Times of India" chya front page war eka 6 mahinyacha mulala dustbin madhye taklela photo aalay....hey kasla pratik? jagrukatecha..ki kevilwanya prasidhiche ki pardarshakta... "Makdachya haataat..." natkaat mediachya hyach bhumikewar changlach prakash takala aahe.. kadhi sadhi milali tar bagha. Varsha

hi To be very honest, western media would have shown the carnage if there was any way of filming it. It is unfair to compare our local media to BBC and CNN. It is quite amusing to read papers like sun and daily mirror. The problem with our media is that the government still controls a large part of it. For e.g. one day before the last local elections, there was one more incidence of desecration of Dr Ambedkar's statue (in Kanpur). This news item even reached the lokmat website for about half an hour. Afterwards there were instructions from the police control room to all the newspapers to stop this news item. I was quite surprised when the reporters I talked to justified this censor-ship in the name of law and order. I really don’t mind cheap items on the news channel (like below mentioned kiss ka kasur), after all news channel is really like a reality TV. and they need to make their money. But I wish they devote a substantial part of the time to real news and factual reporting. regards harsh

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Kolhapuri Pandhara Rassa Chicken sathi 'Kolhapuri Pandhara Rassa' chi recipe kuni sangu shakel ka? Dhanyavaad. ps - preferably web-links nakot. Amit Rajput

Hey hi!! Ek pandhrya pisaachi kombadi (kombda pan chalel je available asel te) ghyavi. Tila saafsuf karun halad mith, aala lasnachi paste lavayun zakun thevaychi. Akha naral khvanaycha.. aani mixer madhun barik karayche aani pani ghalun ghalun ghyacha.. chotha nako yayala. Kadhayee/fry pan tel ghalun tyat lavang / masala velchi/ dalchini.. (zepel tevede) takave. tyat barik chirlela kanda partaava (fry nahi) mag tyat chicken takun waaf kadhavi mag naralache dudh taakave. Aani chicken shijeparyant shijvave. Tips: Gavthi chicken ne jaast changle lagate.. Kahi jan chicken aadhi boil karun ghetaat Kajuchi paste lavli tar ajun changli chav yete. Tandalchya bhakaribarobar khane uttam. Varsha

Varsha.. Nashib he Padma Gust House Kolhapu valyani pahili nahi.. nahitar tithla chef kadhun varsha la nakki appoint kele aste.. Tip: Varsha ne sangitaleli paddhat chicken banavnyachi khupacha chan ahe.. pan pandhara rashyachi nahi... hey krupaya dhanyat ghya... Chandrashekhar

Mhanje ekandarit kahani mein twist !! Recipe sathi dhanyavaad. Unfortunately, mala pandhara rassach pahije. ps - Amchya ithe kombdiche pise khanyachi paddhat naste. Mhanun pisanchya rangala ithe lok jasta mahatva det nahit. ps2- Albino kombdi pan nahi chalnar. Rassach pandhara pahije. Amit

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Hey Hi!! Mi TV war "Maharashtra Maza" Rani Gunaji chya program madhye baghitala.. tyat asach sangitala hota.. Kombadi kontya pisachi te dakhvali navti.. te extra mazyatarphe. AAni tyat doghijani bayka Kolhapuri saaree aani Kolhapuri saaj ghalun dokyawar padar gheun hotya aani tyani to rasssa.. gharchya baher madhyech chul mandun tyawar kela hota... pan tuzyasathi hey kahi upyogache navate mahanun nahi sangitale. Aso.. aamchya TV war tar "pandhara rassa" asach kartana dakhwala hota.. bahuda te Padma wale nastil. Koni navyane sangaar asel tar te pan update karu.. Kalave ..Lobh asava. Varsha

Arre mala kanjinya jhalyat....... Tumhi chicken chy goshti kaslya kartay???? -----Hrishi Amit Tula pandharya rasshyachi recipe ithe milel. http://www.maayboli.com/hitguj/messages/103383/93130.html Regards -Sameer

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Do they really deserve this? The frustration is slowly fading. I think our team was good enough. Our's was the team which could have been a healthy enough competition for Aus and SA on any day. Technically, just one bad game against BD and it ended everything. You cannot defeat SL each and every time. Its 50-50 when you play with them. And the loss against BD means a severe burden while playing against SL and the result showed. BD ain't a bad team anymore. They have beaten other teams too, including AUS when they were no.1. So I guess.... tournament cha format chukicha hota. B) Its sad to see the Indian players getting treated this way. After all, they too are humans. Amit Sorry to differ with you (probably the first time since we met on the net).............but they deserve this .......and probably far worse ! Cricket is by chance is fine... how come the same doesn't ever seem to apply to Australia/New Zealand/South Africa ? At a professional level, you are expected to deliver.........and none of them actually did.. .it is all in their minds........the stereotype predictable collapse............so clichéd..............it is absolutely horrific ! I am sick of it......match after match ! Losing 5 wickets for two runs in a span of 3 overs..........how many times have we seen it all ? The irresponsible lofty sixes falling short and becoming easy catches when they are batting under pressure? The adulation of these undeserving individuals by the desperate Indian media (including the marketing media) To add insult to injury, Star News once showed Sehwag enjoying music on his I-pod sitting in a hotel lobby when he should have been practicing out on the field ...........bola 'practice ka mood nahi hei........'...........that was at the peak of when he was struggling with his form............. no no no Aumit da, we lack that vital killer instinct..........your condoning of the team with such magnanimity reflects the larger Indian psyche............it is this psyche that makes us losers and the likes of determined nations like Australia into winners. chalo chhodo jaane do........ chalo woh bhi kisika beta hai.......chalo galati insaan se hi hoti hai......kab tak ? Time to do away with this softy-softy outlook.....karo ya maro.... bas sssaaaala ! khallaas ! Apala,(santapta) SS

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Dear Shonjoyda, I knew, hardly anybody would agree with me. Neither I wished to sound different than the majority. But why just India? This happens with every team (Australians apart. they are from outer space). NZ is usually reliable only during world cups (which they never win). SL is a different team in absence of Murli and Vaas. England is worse than India I believe. So is WI. SA is still called as chokers even if they are no.1 as on today. They too almost lost the match against SL the other day. Luckily, Peterson got the edge. As Indians, we tend to concentrate more on Indian team's performance that’s why it hurts more. As far as the killer instinct is concerned, I agree with you to an extent. But our guys are working on that aspect too. Chasing 17 (or 18) targets in a row prove that. That is something even Australians haven't achieved. I agree most of them were home wins but still. it ain't a simple task at all. The attitude of this team is very different from the team 10-20 years earlier. But it is a progressive phenomenon. They have to work very hard on that aspect. Attitude doesn't change in a single day. One more example of changing attitude of our team is of Dhoni. 12 out of 16 matches we have won when he has played during chasing. And that is quite a significant record. And Ranchi fans had haircut after his one bad shot against Murli. What I mean to say is nobody wants to loose this way after such a good preparation. I don't think there was a selection error either. One bad day ruins it all though. After all, they are humans too. It's funny how we never think about the good games we've had. It's always the ones that get away that we can't forget. I am still a fan of Team India even after its pathetic performance. Insahallah, lets hope Australians doesn't win this WC. Amit Rajput Hi, Indian teams defeat, in the WC and early exist is not tolerable because of two main reasons..., which are indeed, reasons for the teams losses as well.. 1. The team was OVERCONFIDENT against B'DESH. From Dravid's pre-match talk, I even thought that the team UNDERESTIMATED B'DESH. Considering what happened in the past matches in S'Indies in this world-cup, any one who watches cricket, would have opted to BOWL first after wining the toss against B'DESH. But, surprisingly, Dravid opted to BAT first... It was not confidence on the BATTING SIDE, but OVER COFIDENCE.

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2. Even after we lost the match against B'DESH, we were given a second chance. A win against Lankas, would have secured our place in the super 8s. But we lost, and not only did we lost, we lost WITHOUT PUTTING A FIGHT..See..there is no excuse for things not achieved, because of NOT TRYING... Cricketers, now a days, are more of Models than cricketers. Many of these guys might be spending more time in Studios or ad sessions than in GYM. This is not acceptable. Cricket is not an individual game. For years, (before PACE-Bhupati) were nowhere in tennis. But tennis is rather an individual game. In cricket, you represent your NATION. If Indian team wins, its INDIA who wins not the BLUE BRIGADE or MEN IN BLUE. And so does, if the team losses. Each Indian cricketer must remember that a billion people are watching him and he must give his best on the ground. The team must give its best. Now, even after that the team looses because the opponent played well, I am sure Indian fans will respect Team India. Thanks Abhijit P.S. I personally think that we should not really pay that much attention to cricket that is being played right now. And after all, the match fixing woes, whenever I will watch any cricket match, I will think that I am watching just another REALITY TV SHOW...After all, both, doubtedly, are scripted.... :-)

I completely and whole-heartedly agree with Sanjay-rao. Granted that our cricket players too are humans.. granted that they shouldn't be molested, or ill-treated. But, when they bask in the glow of our adulations, they will also have to face the fury of a billion people who feel cheated upon. I didn't get a chance to watch the matches live, But I saw a few highlights now and then. Somehow, I can't help feeling that our team this time just didn't have the kind of passion required to be deserving contestants. Somehow, they all looked tired, even before the matches began.. their minds seemed distracted. When people like you and me fail to deliver in our professional lives, we DO pay for it... so why not these demi-gods suffer a bit... just for a change? and it doesn’t look they are taking it too badly. What hurts me the most is that Sachin was clean-bowled, on Zero, in what might be most probably his last World Cup match. -G.

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Hey hi!! Mala tar cricket madhyle "Mandira Bedi" (with creative dress designer) pekshahi kami samjate..tarihi WC chya matches aawarjun baghte. WC chalu hoychya kititari aaadhi yenare timetable.. ad world cha WC fobia.. "Team India" la sphuran chadhave mahanun rachleli..gaani.... TV, radio, newspaper.. magazins.. internet saglikade toch vishay. Agdi.. sadhya kapdyachya Rs 10/- sabnaavar war, sadhasa cricket vishyee prashana...aani ameesh matra WC baghyala janachye..haha!! Tar evdha sagla watawaran.. mag khelaat tich "jigar" havi na. Aani ti disli nahi, mag konalahi waait watel. harayache dukha kami zale aste ..jar ladnyachi urmi disli asti tar. Aani.. ti asti..tar kadachit players na lokshobhachi evdhi zal lagli asti..after all, fans are also humanbeings... Varsha

Jay Maharashtra Aplya kheladuna advertise passon vel milto khuthe, tar te practice kartil??? hya sarvana 1varsha ghari basavla phije. Aapan sarvajan ratra jagun hyanchya match baghaychya ani he thithe mast enjoy karun match harnar. Mahesh Aaple kheladu agdi hawarat jhale aahet ase mee samajto. Tyana phakta ads madhoon paise milavnyache ewdhe kalte. Aata aaplya sanghaat ti eki ani ti desh bhakti chi bhavana urleli nahi. Eka maage ek sagle paisa maage dhawat aahet. Pan BCCI ni suddha thode jaastich kele aahe. Tyani pratyek kheladula max 3 endorsements chich parwangi dili aahe. He chukiche aahe, karan ad karna vayaktik nirnay asla paheje, BCCI cha naahi. Theek aahe, jar performance dila nahi, tar paise deu naka. Ani seniors na ta-ta mhana, mahntaat na, "They have overstayed their welcome...". Nimish

Hey Hi!! Saglech jan kheladuncha "ad" chya maage ka? Aapan diwasatun 100 wela ad pahato.. mahanun aaplya tyacha overdose hot asava. Aani changle khelele tar "ad world" madhye pan magni asel nahi tar tyasahi vegla kahi karaychi garaj nahi. Parva ek mast joke wachala... "Arjun aaplya aai Anajali la sangat aala "Aai baba sixer war sixer marataat,," Anajali bharteey naari.. "are ti ad asel.." hahha!! Varsha Raatrabhar jaagnyachi garaj kay? Ekhada booki gatha....tyala vichara aaj kon jinknaar te....ani nivaaant welewar zopa!!! soppe ahe!! Nikhil Ukidwe

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My Haiku: The Great Indian Game Show Drunk Captain, Fallen team Murdered Coach, Missing diary Big Billion Wins, Gentleman’s game Note: This was written before end of Srilankan innings. -Rahul Vaidya

Hey hi!! Shirlanka jinklyananter.. Niraash Dukhi Udaas bhartiy Bhavishachya kaljit kheladu Kaffalak investors ICC niwaant palak,ekta kapoor hmmmm Varsha

A veneer of fairytales only a band aid to cover the fractured hearts I don't believe in fairytales Amit Rajput Distressed Indians Look down on the team Till a win against The Lame. Rahul ----------------------------------

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Rave Party - Pune See image of all the caught during raid on rave party in Pune http://www.esakal.com/esakal/03052007/91EAF5357B.htm ya paiki koNihi aapaNas mahit asel tar mazya vatine tyala ek kansulat haNavi ... puNyacha naav kharaab kelya baddal .. Thanks, Vaibhav Vaibhav, Jo var Nyaylayaat gunha siddha hot nahi tovar kunalahi doshi manu naye. Ya paiki barech lok nordosh asanyachi shakyataa aahe. Halli Punyaat Swayamghosheet Sanskruti Rakshakaancha far peek aala aahe. kansulat haNyasathi itar baryaach goshtee aahet. Kalave. Shrirang Joshi Shrirang I disagree with you... Apan phakta gunha siddha honyachi vat baghat rahaycha ka? Hya asha kityek gosti hotat ani mag kalachya padadya aad jatat.. loka hya gosti nantar visarun jatat ani knowingly or unknowingly apan hya gosti swikarat jato... Isnt it just enough that those people were found there at that place drunk? Ka ti pora pori tithe bhajani mandal madhe arti karayla geli hoti..? Some comments of their parents are... "these kids didnt know they also had charas and other drugs they are going to consume...." Now what to say to those parents... cant even laugh on that... Do you think that is true enough to save their ass..? I wud say their should be strict disiplinary action to be taken against each and everyone who was found at that place in the party... No one should be spared from in the name of bail or anything... Thanks Kedar Kedar, Pratikriye baabat aabhar. Mazya mate Samajala sudharavinyapurvee manasane swatala sudharave. 1. Sarvajanik sthalee aapali waganook aadarsh asaavi. 2. Itar vyakteenkade baghnyachi drushtee hi nikop asaavi. 3. Sabhyateche a maryaadeche palan karave. 4. Vaiyakteek hitapudhe samaaj-hitacha balee deu naye. He sarva karoo shakanaryani Samaajala sudharvinyachya goshtee karavyat. Kunacha Kayamcha Ilaj karane / kansulaat hanane ashee bhasha vaparane mhanje asabhya - va asanskrutpanache lakhsan aahe. Kalave, Shrirang Joshi http://groups.yahoo.com/group/marathidtnet

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Ya aslya faltugiri mule Pune kaay, akkhya deshachi waat laagat aahe. Part la gelela pratyek manushyala tithe kaay chalu ahe, he nakkihmahit aste. Gunha karne aani gunha karnaryanche samarthan karne, he ekach goshta aslya kaarnane, tya rave partit aslelya pratyek manushyacha photo paper madhye chapoon aanla pahije. Aani, nantar mag nyayalayeen kaarvayee karoon, partyche aayojan karnaryana phashi dili pahije. Nimish

Atak jhalelyanpaiki kadachit kahi jan nirdosh astil hi. Pan nishedh hya goshticha karavasa vaatato ki tyanni yenarya pidhila chukichya aadarshachi pahili paayri chadhun dakhavli ahay. Jar aaj apan gapp baslo tar udya tumchya/amchya mula-mulinchya hyasam vartanabaddal aakshep ghyaycha kinva changale valan laavaycha adhikaar aaplyala asel kaay? Ekhadi ghatana Punyatach kaay - deshaat kinva jagaat kuthehi ghado -aapali pratikriya kashi ahay hyavarunach aaplyanantarchi pidhi shiknaar ahay. Saglyanni ghadlya prakaraabaddal gappa basa ani pudhchya pidhila deshodhadila laava; mag hich chuk tyaveli tyanni keli ki tevha paschattap karun kaay upayog aahe?! Ghadalya prakaraat kaay gair hotay hay apan joparyanta pudhchya pidhila patavun det nahi toparyanta aaplay uttardaayitva paar padat nahi. Kadachit aaplyala kaansulaat chadhvayche adhikaar pan nahit, kadachit astil hi...Pune shaharachya premapoti nighalele udgaar asavet asa me maanto. Pan khare pahile tar Bhartiya parampara, tatva-moolya ani asmita hyavar shintoday udaale ahet. Ani hya prakaarat saamil asnaaray aaplech deshvaasi kaay kinva ithe shikshanakarta aalele parapraantiya kaay -sagalech sujaan ahet - tyanna apan karat aslelya krutiche dushparinaam mahit ahet - kaaran itkya vela prasaar maadhyamanni ordun-ordun sangitlay ahay... Taridekhil tay hyaat sahabhagi hotay...ani pakadle gelyavar shivi-gaal pan kela. Asha paschattap-vihin mansanvar aapla krodh tari ka vyartha ghalvaava? Pan, tyanna "maraychi haus ahay na...khushaal maru det!" asa kitihi mhanavasa vaatala tari "Saare bhartiya majhe baandhav ahet" ashi shapath lahanpanapasun ghetaana jo jivhaala nirmaan jhaala ahay, tyaala kaay karave? Na rahavun bolale jaate...raagavle jaate. Krupaya sambandhit bandhavanni aamchya bhavana samjun ghyavya ani aapla maarga sudhaarnyacha praamanik prayatna karaava hich apeksha! Amhi tumhala vaalit taaku ichhit nahi ani dweshbuddhi pan rakhun thevnaar nahi; pan kamit-kami aamhi chuklo...parat chuk nahi karnaar ani pudhchya pidhyanna hi karu denaar nahi...ashi gvahi/hami amhaala deu shaklaat tari pushkal jhaala! Sanchet Dighe

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I think Rave Party Episode is blown out of proportion....I don’t think this is a big crime.....In Goa this happens every night.....wat happened to Nithari case...Police is still not came to conclusion to this case....and they are after such minor issues like Rave Party.....Taking drugs is not crime in my book....as far as person is not forced to have drugs and he is not underage Pratek mansala mahit aahe to kai karto...it is his personal choice...loka daru pitat..cigrate pitat...mag Rave party madhe charus/drugs ghetat...and they know the drawbacks....only thing is if they are not harming anybody...i have no problems with such parties and Police also shd not have any problem... There are much larger crimes to take care of than these Rave Parties....common leave them alone...they know very well about their future...and they are themselves responsible for thier destruction.... Uday Perfect.. And drug addiction SHOULD not be treated as crime (like alcoholism), it is more like disease. In such cases, counseling is much more effective. Kanfatit marna sopa asta.. paN tyani kaahi sadhya hota naahi. Rahul Its fine to say consuming the drugs is personal choice. But possession, sale, or purchase of drug is certainly a crime. The drugs are proven to be dangerous for human life so certainly its a crime. However, I do agree that consuming drugs should not be considered as very BIG crime, since it does not (directly) harm other than the person who consumes it. Since this is not big crime like harming others, the punishment should be softer. I would like bring up another topic for discussion with this thread Should there a mild punishment like doing some service for community, social cause for this addicts? Or to other milder crimes like road accidents, eve-teasing (up to certain extent), damage to public property, spitting on roads, throwing garbage..... Such a punishment can help the country's growth in some way rather than spending the tax payers’ money on feeding the prisoners. Views are welcome Regards, Ashutosh Joshi hi I hate to disagree. Consuming drugs causes harm to other people. It has been established that drugs and crime-rate go hand in hand since drug users need to get quick money to buy drugs. We need to throw these people in jail and beat the xxxx out of them. We don’t need this western virus in India. regards harsh

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Hi Harsh, The modus operandi of the whole problem starts with the Drug Peddler that makes a business out of this... In U.S.A. the whole problem was caused due to the drug peddlers gave away free chocolates or cigarettes laced with the drugs to school going children, making them drug addicts at a very young age... What about India in this case (Pune)? I agree to your second point that those people who were caught should be put behind bars and treated like Criminals... but do not blame Western Culture (DRUGS ARE NOT MADE IN USA or UNITED KINGDOM) for that...we have to blame Pakistan and Afghanistan as its the worst Virus that is spreading the drugs to the whole world... Its very easy to blame Western Culture for everything... why should people from India follow the Western culture when they know that our culture is the greatest there is? To copy Western Culture is very easy... as they really do not have any values like us... I mean (a) Family Values (b) Respect for teachers (c) Respect for their wives (well in India I have seen many families who treat their women with contempt and disrespect) (d) Love and Care for their new born babies... (they keep them in a crib in a separate room and close the door and go to their room for privacy... due to which there was an influx of Hippy Culture... (e) In Western Culture the equate Love to Sex... for them love does not spring from heart but they make love... BUT its not all that bad... they have their good points too... 1. They have a larger heart and would line up to help a person who need blood transfusion or Bone Marrow transfusion... they also take over the hospital payments of poor and needy people... 2 When they trust you they do it completely...When they become your friends they will be the friend you will love to have around you... as they are dependable... People from Western Culture have been exposed to the Indian Culture and they love the basic principles of our culture and we should be proud of it...however there are I have a great number of Western Friends as I live in California, USA for 31 years and they have adopted Indian style of living and culture... as a matter of fact they go to the temples and attend pujaa session and also have their wills made that their bodies be cremated in a Hindu style... Some of them go to the University to study Vedas... Show me one Indian who goes to the University to learn Vedas. If you go to Indian Temples here you will find White Americans playing Mridangams and tablas, Veena and Saarangis, reciting Sanskrit Slokas... I am sure many of us do not know Sanskrit and must have taken French or German in High school and omitted Sanskrit... So in short, Western people are fascinated by the good side of Indian Culture, then why should the Indian be enamored by the bad (worst side of Western Culture???

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We as a human try to come up in life by study and practice of good things which the Western people are doing where as the people (like those caught in Pune) try to fall in the dirt and roll in it like pigs...so who is to blame? God has give us this life so lets make the best use of it... Thank you Lucky

Ha ha.. Putting people in Jail and beating blah blah.. U will make the helpless victim even more helpless. We have Alcoholic Anonymous for drunkards. What we need is similar thing, good counseling, and proper rehabilitation. And I agree. Those who sell drugs and smuggle them, should be given harsh punishment. May be death penalty like in Singapore. But not for those who only consume them. RV

hi Rahul Please go thru the list of people arrested. Most of them have rich parents who don’t care what their children are doing. And who don’t see drugs as a big deal. The first time I was offered a brown sugar in Pune was long time back. It was during a rockfest in Fergusson college, the gang was mostly Maharashtrians from Mumbai with rich parents, I think 2-3 guys father were the pilot in Indian airlines. I have seen and observed the drug problem first hand in India and overseas for a long time. regards harsh

By the way guys do you know that drugs were used in India since a long time??? Ganja and Opium was available in any Panwallas shop... most of the working mothers who had kids to look after, but no means to look after them gave a little Opium in the milk so the child would sleep till she came back home... Sometimes the child would die due to overdose... Anyway as it is illegal, these "poor and helpless" people should be punished... If not why should a poor murderer be given Life Imprisonment or Death by Hanging? They also did those crimes unknowingly in a fit of rage... Lucky

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hi 1. Trust me no one has given them free chocolates. It does not happen this way in India. 2. It is the market in USA and Europe, which is to be, blamed not the producers in Afghanistan. 3. I do not agree that our culture is the greatest but that’s a point for another discussion, regards harsh

Hi, You must not be aware of the marketing techniques used in the western part of the world... If you say that nothing is offered fro free... its true... but only when the children are hooked on to the drugs in their young age they will crave for it and then go and buy it at whatever price its available... That is the crudest marketing... but it has helped some of the people in getting a lot of money and power... First they give out free products, and when you are sufficiently hooked on it or comfortable with it then wham they got you by the balls and make you pay for it... some examples... 1. Just a few months back they sent every home with a Gillette Fusion Razor free... its definitely better than the earlier model (at least I liked it and so did others) so now we are buying the blades at a higher price since then... 2. You must have definitely heard of AVG (Anti-Virus) Software... previously they were giving this software for free with the license to use for a year with all the updates... now they only give you free for 30 days... then it becomes inactive... 3. Gevalia Coffee send you a free coffee maker with designer set of mugs, with an agreement that they will ship you at least 2 to 3 bags of coffee every month... 4. If you visit the wine country, in Napa valley, California... they will give you different varieties of wines to taste... (many people go there just to get intoxicated by their free shots) but many do buy a case or many as per their capacity... In India too if you go to a sweet shop you can get free sample of barfi or pedha so that your tongue which would like the taste would make you, buy at least half a kilo to two kilos... Yes my friend they did give free drug laced goodies to school going children... at least as it was reported in New Jersey... An Indian mother noticed that her son came from school with read and heavy eyes as if walking in sleep... and she took him to the clinic and the doctor said that h has been under the influence of drugs... when he came out of the trance he told her that some person was distributing chocolates

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She reported it to the local police and they kept a watch and nabbed the guy... anyway that Indian family moved back to Mumbai as then they were scared that they would be targeted by the Drug cartel... Well its up to you to believe it or not... but tell me my friends if drugs are not produced... how would you buy? Only if you produce certain things in access then its exported to foreign countries for foreign exchange... I know you have hot against the Western people or their culture... so lets leave this discussion at that... I do not think that poor people can afford such luxuries... so people who do drugs... I would not have any compassion but the people who deal and sell drugs should be skinned alive, or made to consume all the drugs forcibly... In USA the fine for the Drug Peddler is that his car and property are sized and auctioned, while he is put behind bars with no pay-role... Lucky

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We Desi parents are too competitive Hi all, I have wanted to talk abt this topic with you all for some time now but just didn't get a chance. Why are we desi parents so competitive when it comes to our kids? Lot of Indian kids here in US have busier schedules than a company executive. They go to school and then for piano, tennis, karate, kumon(to enhance their skills in school), dance, music, skating, etc etc etc. Kids have no time to day dream and just stay home and do nothing. Why? ? When I had to choose a school for my daughter, I chose the one that had very less desis. And I did this to protect me from all the other desi moms :) B'cos the typical conversation between me and others would have been - "what? your kid is not taking a million classes? why? don't you want her to be a doctor/singer/dancer/karate champion/Nobel prize winner ???? " :) I strongly believe that kids need time to do NOTHING, to day dream, to fight with their brother/sister, think abt something to annoy Aai. We still expect our kids to become doctors and scientists. What is wrong if they want to be a chef (look at Sanjeev Kapoor, he did very well in life) or be an entrepreneur or a teacher?? Kumon classes in US are filled with Indian kids. What is the hurry to teach 2+2=4 to a 3 yr old ??? We want our kids to skip grade and go ahead. And I'll tell you what happens to such kids in US - till 3-4 grade everything goes fine but by sixth grade, all the other American kids shoot up, grow taller, bigger and this desi kid remains the baby of the class and gets all sorts of problems trying to fit into older age group. I don't know guys, this is what I think. We Indians need to take a chill pill sometimes and let our kids excel more in day dreaming. Cheers, Anjali

Re: I guess what my fiancé says makes sense now. She says - We both have been thro a bit of stress, both academic and of life. Our kids should be free from all kinds of restrictions. If its a son, she says, she wouldn't let him study at all. He should be absolutely free from all the burdens. He should go to school only if he wishes to. College education is out of question. He should be free from all the inhibitions. He should happily beat up other children and we shouldn't scold him. We should earn enough for his sake so that life wouldn't bother him even if he becomes a mawali. Its too early to comment but I will keep you all updated on his progress. Amit Rajput

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Well Amit, Keep me updated about your whereabouts.. I will want to protect my kids from yours.. ;) I perfectly agree with Anjali's observation that now a days kids are overburdened.. But I have a feeling that parents are to be blamed more than just peer pressure. Today’s parents want more freedom with life and want kids out of way as much as possible. May be its because today's parents work more than ever before. They spend more time traveling than ever before. And of course peer pressure has its own part.. But I feel that we are creating a generation of zombies where everybody will think alike and behave alike.. (Like contestants of Ms World :p) Rahul

hi I think the problem is that desi parents want their kids to do too many things. The Indian attitude of Jack of all trades and master of none. I met one of my cousins in India and believe me his 4 year old son, knows a few words from Marathi, Hindi, English, and German. He already plays little bit of Tabla/Peti and his mom was talking about his exam results etc etc. I was totally speechless. My son is 3 years old and does nothing of this sort*lol* I do not see anything wrong with this. regards harsh Hi, I do not completely agree with all of you. As far as singing , dance etc classes are concerned I agree Indians stress too much. But regarding education I believe they do the right thing. There are several reasons for an Indian parent to stress on studies. We Indians grow up in extremely competitive environment. We struggle a lot compared to our counterparts in other continents. Population may be a culprit to some extent. Education is mainly the means to better life for middle class. Another reason is dignity of labour.(We can improve on this) Indians believe only in air conditioned offices, cars etc. Alternate professions are looked down upon. It is this environment that makes them push their children. Believe me I hated college, its "Indian Parents" who are responsible for what I am today. Thanks to them.... Arati.

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Hi Arati, The point here is that how much to stress on education. Whether learning 5 languages at the age of 3 will help him in being a world class writer? Whether attending Kumon class will make a child an Einstein? The importance of education should be limited to making sure that the child knows what is being taught in the class well. Not that he should be able to do calculus at the age of 10. (This e.g. is taken from Kumon official website. The founder’s son was able to do calculus at the age of 10 following this methodology. But the website fails to mention his further achievements). And I am not saying that the child must be stopped from learning things. If the child has aptitude for Math he will surely excel with little guidance from parents. I am very sure, the next Einstein will not be from the generation that attended special math coaching at the primary school level. RV > Arati said -> But regarding education I believe they do the right thing. > There are several reasons for an Indian parent to stress on studies. > We Indians grow up in extremely competitive environment. We struggle a lot compared to our counterparts in other continents. > Population may be a culprit to some extent. Education is mainly the means to better life for middle class. Education is important, but that doesn't mean that you start teaching addition/subtraction to a 3 yr old!!!!! You say that we Indians grow up in extremely competitive environment - that's b'cos everybody is doing nothing but trying to be a doctor/engg/scientist/software guy. Why not encourage our kids to become a good, honest policeman or a great teacher or a journalist ??? Also, have you guys noticed that most Indians of our generation have no hobbies, no passion in life. That's b'cos as kids we were asked to study study study. You said - "Education is mainly the means to better life for middle class" – but that does not hold true to most of the desis here in US. They earn good money, have big houses, and drive very good cars. What do you say to that? Anjali

Hey hi!! Are parva tar aankhi ek kissa... eka music shop madhye ek young couple CDs ghyala aale hote. Tyana lahan mulanchya CDs havya hotaat sanskaar (??) karnyasathi, tyat shlok, stavan hya sarva barobarch english rhymes, baalkatha , panchatantra and Albhabet aani numbers shivnaarya pan. Mag tyana vicharle gele "kiti varshacha aahe?" (karan barobar koni lahan mul disat navata..). Kai mast lajle doghe.. aani sangitale "due aahe.. 4 mahinyane". Uff!! Bola aata.. Varsha

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"What is wrong in being a good, honest policeman or a great teacher or a journalist" Answer is simple. In India it doesn’t pay. Journalist/Teacher/ Policeman do pay well and give lot of respect if the person is extra ordinary and lucky too. But every body cannot hope to be extraordinary or lucky either. Thus the safest bet is to become Engineer/Doctor. Days are changing, and journalism might soon become a great profession. Likewise Lawyer. But no hopes for those who want to be a policeman :). Rahul Vaidya Hi, I agree with Rahul that jobs Anjali mentioned don’t pay much. In US even if a person does not go to college they can get a good job, and most of the jobs do pay well. It does not harm an American to dream during school days, never go to college, and pursue their dream profession as they get paid well. Hobbies is a totally different issue. spending habits of Indian and American are different.(saving vs. spending) But nowadays Indians do have hobbies and are also ready to spend a lot on their hobbies(but again reason is that education has given them money). Anjali regarding "day dreaming"- thanks to "day dreaming" Americans, many Indians have ended up having jobs in US:) If all Americans would go to college like Indians they would not need us:) Arati. hi Its not the education it is the attitude due to which Indians get the jobs. Indians are ready work harder and longer hours to get something done. Any employer appreciates such employees. regards harsh Hi all, Well, I was reading all the replies and counter-arguments in it from all of you. I would like to mention my couple of observations: 1) It is the condition of Indian parents not only in the US but also in India. Moreover, further I would say that it is the condition of parents in Italy, Singapore, Thailand, Japan, and China also. I mean the spirit of competition and the style of putting stress on children. 2) Personally I feel it is a kind of BOOM .........I mean, this was the condition of parents 50 to 60 years back in the western developed countries. That is to engage their child in as many activities as they can. After all they wanted to make their children obviously

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doctors, scientists etc. They wanted to be the most efficient and alert parents (as per child psychology) in the development of their ward. What is the result after 60 years of such BOOM? Now, very few wants to continue for University education. Most of the children doesn't get along with their parents ......so they leave the home at the age of 17-18 as they can get money from their government's social welfare funds. Here in India also all such BOOMS are there among wealthy parents. Parents who don't have sufficient money for feeding the whole family and for giving basic education to their children .........will never come under this BOOM. 3) Monetary attraction and attraction to be in a developed western country are the only reasons to go to professions like MBA, s/w field, Engg and medicine. Nobody want their children to study languages and be a good linguist or a research scholar in any field. Even nobody wants to become a research scholar in any field. Because there is no money. Even in marriage market it counts. I do remember that there is (and still it is there) a BOOM among upper middleclass and middleclass people for sending their children to US for MS or PhD. The pattern is already set: 10th - 12th (sci) - Engg/ Medicine/MBA/MA Psychology - GRE + TOEFL - MS (US) or PhD (US). For children from poor families or village families: 10th -12th (sci) - DEd - or Graduation (BEd) - either primary or secondary teacher. If a person manage to get further for MEd then can become a lecturer in the college. Here I have written almost standard patterns. Those who manage to get into Indian civil services or regional civil services become expert in managing everything including money that they have spent to get into the system. For son/daughter of a politician cum industrialist in education (like Karad, Kadam etc) they become instant Principal's of any college set by their father's institution. 4) I also have heard that many of these NRI's now started realising that their children are not taught proper Indian culture and history. So they want their children to learn Indian history and culture along with Mathematics and science. In some colleges in the US and Canada it is compulsory (from their parents) for undergrad students (Indian) to take Indian history and culture as one of the subjects to pass their undergraduate course. 5) Indian picture is always confusing to me as I can see both the sides at the same time. Like on the one hand you can see Indian industrialists like Tata are buying the companies in the western countries and on the other hand there are thousands of farmers who are not able to pay their debts. On the one hand we can see so many Indian students going abroad to study or even many foreign universities are coming to invest in India but on the other hand there are many children who are not getting basic quality education and food and the quality of Indian higher education research (through universities) is going down. I cannot predict anything regarding this BOOM of competitive parents .......where it will lead......... Only I would like to pray that "GOD GIVE THESE PEOPLE A THOUGHT REGARDING OTHERS WHO ARE NOT LIKE THEM AND WHO CANNOT GET THE FACILITIES LIKE THEM" It is enough for me if they could become good and sensitive human beings. Thanks Aparna

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Re: We Desi parents ... stop comparing please, and also no dictatorship I am just got out college, so I know the effects of competition on my parents. The problem with them is that they ignore the details and read only the headlines. For example "My son is going to the United States". This line is commonly heard by my mom, who asks me a 1000 times, why I have Failed to go to the US. But the details most of the times as much as 75% - 80% cases say : "My son is going to the United States. He did not score enough, so we are trying to get him to do an MS." C'mon, if I get 60%, do a PG and get a good job in a good company, why should I go to the US? Why do parents keep comparing us with others? Sometimes, in their quest to see their kids "do something great", they do not think twice in insulting their kids in public, like "Arre tula kahick kalat nahi, amkya amkya chya mulani amkya amkya college mahoon degree milavli aahe, to mhanto tech khare asnaar." Gimme them a break guys, give us a chance. Are parents ashamed to call that particular kid; their son or daughter, as in the case above? And worst of all, "tichi mulgi he he amka amka karte, tu mulga asun suddha ase karu shakat nahis mhanje kaay?" What crap. Are girls nothing? Should they only sit and keep the house? And this has been heard from mothers who are working women themselves. So does this lady mean that she is inferior than some male working at an equivalent position in her office? Why do parents not think twice about what their words sound like to their children? And remember that all kids are not the same. A friend of mine did not do well till 12th. He hardly ever crossed 60%. Today, he is successful in his career as a hospitality manager in some UK hotel. His parents gave him full freedom, otherwise he would be doing something that he might to have liked. Let children decide what they want to do. Give them proper advice, but please do not enforce your will on them. Nimish Hello NImish, I can totally understand what you are saying. The example that you gave of that friend of your who did OK (acc. to lot of parents) till 12th grade and now has a good career - that was a perfect one. What saddens me is that parents of my generation are repeating the same mistakes that our parents did. Let the kids live a little, please. Every 3 yr old who can add 1+1 is NOT going to become Einstein. When will parents realize this??? If the kid says "I want to learn dancing" then you join a dance class. And not that the other kids are doing it so you force your kid to learn. What parents don't realize that younger kids don't know how to show their frustration BUT when they grow up and follow careers that did not wish for then all comes crashing down.

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What is worse that having your grown up kids say to you "You did not let me follow my dreams" ?? Generations till now have already proved to the world that we Indians are intelligent but let our kids prove to them that they are also very creative, adventurous, athletic and can win lots of Olympic gold medals. :) Cheers, Anjali

Hello, I do agree with Anjali, but differ slightly. People are looking for all round development of kids. Parents are making personal/professional sacrifices do spend quality time with kids. Though the number of these parents may not be very huge, but yes there is a change. I totally agree with her as we are so much in comparison mode always. One need to respect individuality of the kid. You cannot have photocopies---( I mean whatever other's kid does ours should also do). But yes there is long way to go, but there is hope. Regards Vijay Deshpande

interesting discussion, very true, in India white collar profession is preferred. forget abt. journalist or policeman, if u r a carpenter, shoemaker / repairer, u r nothing. I feel every profession is needed in our world, and no profession is to be looked down on. I have been visiting India every three or four years and I notice changes, towards betterment as well as towards worse. The more u see the world, more efforts u take to "change the world" Abt. education in India my observation ( at least in pune) is that it is just 'ghokampatti'. students don't learn to learn by experimenting but they read and learn things by heart. if one learns things 'by heart' I mean willingly, while one wants to know how things work and not just to get good score in the school, they will certainly learn better. hobbies are not always hobbies to 'spend money on', hobbies can also be watching nature without camera or whatever. just observing and trying to understand things. I am hopeful, that things r changing, also in India. we compare India with an elephant, it takes time, and still he starts running. Nalini

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Tamilnadu-madhil Marathi manasathi Tamilnadu madhil marathi Namskar Mandali Tamilnadu madhhe jar apali marathi manse astil tar tyana tikade marathi jevanyachi soy ahhe ka? Kuni asel tar sanga? ani jar nasel tar aplyala kahi tari vichar karayala havay Tumchya uttarachi vat pahat ahhe Apala Kshitij Yelkar www.yelkar.com Hi, You mean WHOLE of TamilNadu? or some specific towns/cities? And, "aaplyaala kaahitari vichaar karaayla hawaa" mhanje nakki kaay karaayche? Do you plan to start a chain of Marathi restaurants? I didn't get the direction of your mail. Rather than worrying about what Marathi maaNus will eat in TamilNadu, we should be thinking about Marathi people right here in Maharashtra. With the Udupi and Punjabi hotels swarming in every nook and corner of almost all major cities in Maharashtra, it is getting difficult to get pure Maharashtrian food here itself. -G.

Hey hi!! Aaplya savayeech aata global zalaya aahet...aamchyakade tar ekhada parmparik padharth bhaher khaalla ki tyala "gharguti" mahanychi padhat padli aahe. Varsha

Hi G, As soon as I read the heading of this mail I thought of different situations........like situation of Maharashtrians in Belagaon..... But when I read the mail I felt it as a wrong number!! I was thinking about right from food styles to languages. South Indian food like Idali, Dosa, Utappa have become very familiar and we have accepted it as one of our food items. We have also accepted Punjabi food. Even our Vada-Pav, Pav-bhaji is accepted everywhere in India. I don't find any reason to search for Maharashtrian food in Tamil Nadu. Jaisa Des vaisa Bhes......similarly we can eat the food items in Tamil Nadu. Yes, when we go to Bengal, Arunachal or Nagaland where most of the food items contain Non-veg food, a person like me will ask for veg food. If you go in the west then Indian food is very famous. Why we want to divide Indian culture and food in various states?

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Why to discriminate and bring communalism? I mean such things starts from very small events. When Marathi books and libraries are banned in Belgaon, when Marathi medium schools are closed down in Belgaon by Karnataka government, it was just for political reasons. How many people think from a pure language point of view? Language and culture goes by hand in hand. This is how we have lost so many precious Indian languages. If we start separating the states by language then don't you think so that it will not take much time to divide India? Why in Assam Bihari people are killed? Why Keralites and Tamilians they don't accept Hindi and want to be separated from India? I am sure if we continue so, then Mumbai will become a Union Territory in next 10 years as in Mumbai many languages are spoken. Same thing can be said about Bangalore. Pune is also becoming an IT city. It might happen in Pune as well. Do you think is it correct? Think and reply. Thanks Aparna

Hi all, The best thing I like abt us Maharashtrians is that we perfectly adjust to any situation or place. Where ever we go, we rarely face problems with food. We are not like lot of south Indians who HAVE to have sambar and HAVE to have their particular pickles. Believe me, my in-laws, being Telugu people, always have major problems when they travel. Traveling with them here in US is a major event. Once when we had taken them to Las Vegas, I had carried with me rice, rice cooker, daal , etc. And the first thing we did after reaching Las Vegas is to buy a big dabba of dahi :) So, instead of worrying what Marathi people are eating in Tamil Nadu let's worry abt how Marathi people can come up in other areas, like business, networking, etc. Cheers, Anjali

Hi Anjali, My experiences are exactly opposite.. You find more number of tamilians and Telugites in Mumbai (and even Pune) than Maharashtrians in Chennai. (Hyd is an exception as it is very near to Maharashtra border). And you will find more of them even in US. Maharashtrians are just a miniscule minority compared to south Indians and Punjabis.. Then how do u think we adjust to any situation? Rahul Vaidya

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Hi Rahul, First of all, we have Mumbai and hence Marathi people don't need to go to Chennai and other places. People from other cities come to us. We have more south Indians in Mumbai because of obvious reasons. What was there in Chennai and Hyderabad 15 - 20 yrs back? Nothing to challenge bright minds. And hence lot of south Indians came to Mumbai. And do you really think there are less Maharashtrians in US? Do you know that Seattle has a huge Marathi convention this coming June ??!! We have a Marathi convention every 2 yrs !!! I agree that there are more south Indians, Punjabis, and Gujjus in US but Marathi junta is not less either. Only thing that I see as a problem is that Marathi junta is not well connected and networking is not that good. We lack business skills and don't have the support system like the Gujjus and Punjabis. We are more into Kala and Sahitya (which is great) but we need to improve our other skills now. Cheers, Anjali

Gautam hit the bull’s eye.... I don't understand one thing...is unavailability of OUR food a big problem such that somebody SHOULD DO SOMETHING about it..? If yes, then I think we are still stuck in attitude. This is the age of globalisation. Ones success depends on how much faster he/she adjusts to changing conditions. and this is true about the community as well. I think we should really stop CARING about such trifle of problems. As far as starting off a chain of Marathi Restaurants goes...its a really good idea.. We can invest in this. Thanks Abhijit

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India - China - Maharastra What our politicians and news papers do not tell us. =================================== This has a direct effect on industrialized states like Maharashtra. India-China bilateral trade in 1999 was 2 billion dollars. India-China bilateral trade in 2005 was about 19 billion dollars, with India enjoying trade surplus. India-China bilateral trade in 2006 was about 25 billion dollars, with China enjoying trade surplus of around 4 billion dollars. Indian trade deficit (with China) of 4 is not a big deal. That is unless you look at the detailed picture. ================================== Indian exports to China are mostly in low-value added goods like Iron ore. Indian imports from China are mostly industrialized goods. Do you spot the problem? We are exporting base commodities and in return we are loosing jobs due to import from China. Our industries will collapse if this state of affairs continues. We must put in protectionist methods till China learns to play a fair game. Harsh Industry is already lobbying to stop export of iron ore.. I expect that the lobbying will work soon.. And why do you always think that the deficit is always bad? That is too generic a statement. We should have more data than just deficit that too only of a single country to make big judgments of what is good for a country and what is not.. If it was so easy why do we have PhDs in economics as both PM and finance minister? :)\ Rahul Vaidya hi I am not talking about deficit over here. In 2006 China exported around goods worth 14.50 billion us dollars to India. This means our manufacturing was cut-off by the same amount, which further means a huge number of jobs were lost. Indian industry cannot compete with China who use unfair trade practices. As to the prime-minister, don’t forget that he leads a very fragile government (this is why this government introduced reservations for Muslims, and further thinking about reservations in the private sector). Further, a PHD does not necessarily make him an excellent prime-minister. Take a look at the most successful prime-ministers/presidents around the world and check out their degrees. regards harsh http://groups.yahoo.com/group/marathidtnet

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Marathi.Net Mind Storms

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he he.. I was just stating with respect to economics.. Don’t u think a PHD in economics will make him understand better regarding the economy than you and me? Fair or unfair, it is not a solution to protect the Indian industry.. We will only give shelter to mediocre products. And why do you think that 14.5 billion trade means 14.5 billion loss of manufacturing efforts. Don’t u think that they are better in producing electronic goods while India doesn’t have the required competency? We are better at IT than they and many Indian IT companies are setting up shops there. In this globalize world, such things don’t matter any more. Rahul Vaidya

hi A PHD in economics does not make him the best person in managing the economy. If that was the case then every finance minister at least in the western world would have had a doctorate. This is just an Indian obsession with paper degrees that I completely fail to understand. And this is something that I could never explain to my European friends. However, the bad part is that having a doctorate in economics may make him susceptible to managing the economy at the micro-level and that will never work for a country as large as India. Managing at micro-level would only work in case of city-states like Singapore. As to producing electronic goods: what makes you think they are better? Mate! the quality of Indian products is way better than "made in" China products. Think of China as a big "ulhasnagar" industry. They don’t spend a dime in research (they just steal the technology), they don’t spend a dime in terms of environmental effect (compared to even India), land is up for grabs and you have to hold a gun to their head to make them pay better salaries. They don’t give a damn for quality and have a lot of experience in terms of stealing from other people’s pockets. I had the mis-fortune of working for a couple of Chinese employers*s* Unfortunately we Indians are always stuck in our internal argument and never care about external factors. However, the long term forecast for fuel is considerably below the current level. In fact fuel prices have started going down and we will see a massive backslash to China coming from Europe and USA within an year or two. regards harsh

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Marathi.Net Mind Storms

Vol. III

Wrong move to stop goods from china on account of loosing jobs, Indian industrialists are sucking people and non competent they should be more competitive No need to protect them. They want higher margins ,profits and don’t want to improve on quality. If CHINEES products are cheap and good quality why stop Indian industries should learn to be more productive. Manoj

dear Rahul it is good that industry is lobbying. Only PhD is not enough. hi level motivation is required at any level but particularly top level. I have reservation abt PCC. He is going along with Left people that are never on Right side. any way these are my feeling. regards Vilas Bhagwat

hi I agree with you, high level of motivation is certainly needed. When we talk about economy of the country, in essence we are talking about people, the ability to understand people, manage people, and motivate people and so on. Look at any economic crash since 1950's and look at any economic revival during the same period. Look at the factors and you will find it is always people, people, people. A PHD has got nothing to do with ability to manage people. May be it is a requirement for RBI chief, may be finance minister. But certainly not prime-minister. In fact looking at the independence day speech, I feel he is going down the wrong path (as pointed out by Murthy chairman of Infosys). regards harsh ps: as to deficit may not be harmful.. take it with a tone of salt. There lots of other prerequisites for deficit to be a successful growth vehicle.

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