200906 Newsletter

QUEENSLAND BUSHWALKERS CLUB Inc.

74 Kallista Rd. Rochedale South QLD 4123 Email [email protected] Phone No (07) 3341 7509 www.geocities.com/qldbwc

Newsletter

June 2009

Mt Matheson

Club News Guest Speakers from Globe Trekker

State of the Tracks

Daniel Ray and Zac Stone of Globe Trekker gave a talk on the latest bushwalking gear and equipment available at the May Club meeting. On show was a wide variety of bushwalking equipment such as boots, stoves, head lights, water purifiers, jackets and tents.

Springwood National Park

After a talk by Daniel and Zac, members had an opportunity to ask questions and to try out some of the gear. There were also gift vouchers and gifts handed out to members during the presentation. Globe Trekker is situated at 142 Albert St., Brisbane and stocks a very wide range of quality products. The staff would be only be too happy to assist members in purchasing any bushwalking gear. They are offering a 12½% discount to Club members if the Club membership card is shown.

Walks Planning Day

21 June 2009

A Walks Planning Day will be held at 16 Ramita Street, Holland Park West on Sunday 21st June 2009. It will start at 11.00 AM and will be followed by a BBQ.

Purling Brook Circuit Track (eastern side) is closed due to dangerous landslides from floods in Jan 2008. It could be open by January 2010. Lamington National Park Albert River Circuit is presently closed. The West Canungra Creek Circuit between Yerralahla and Yanbacoochie Falls is closed due to flood damage. Main Range National Park Planned burning may be scheduled in the Cunningham's Gap and Spicer's Gap sections of Main Range National Park from June 9th till 31st July 2009. Some temporary walking track closures may occur as a result.. Glass House Mountains National Park Mount Beerwah summit trail, including access to the cliff face lookout, is closed until further notice due to a major rock fall. The day-use area's picnic and toilet facilities remain open. On-thespot fines are issued for accessing an area closed to the public.

All present and would be leaders are invited to attend as the Club walking calendar is looking very bare July onwards.

First Aid Course

Warrie Circuit is presently closed due to multiple dangerous landslides. It is expected that the Warrie Circuit repairs should be finished and ready for visitors by the end of this year.

25 July 2009

A First Aid course for leaders is being planned for QBW leaders for Saturday, 25 July 2009. If you are interested in doing a First Aid course or a refresher for CPR please contact Stuart Mackay on 3890 8196 so that numbers can be finalised.

Mt Coonowrin (Crookneck) is closed to public access without a permit. Moreton Island National Park A few sections of the Island are still closed to allow for further cleaning and rehabilitation following the oil spill in March.

Track Repairs

Areas remaining closed are:

Leaders are advised to check the condition of tracks as there are several closures due to recent rain, ongoing repairs or planned burning.

The northern coast of the island from North Point (including Champagne Pools) around to Cape Cliff.

The latest information is available on the EPA website at http://www.epa.qld.gov.au/projects/park/news.cgi

The oil spill response staging area at Blue Lagoon.

Spitfire Creek wetland. Eagers Creek wetland and adjacent staging area.

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General Information

The Management Committee

Meeting Place

President

Patricia Kolarski

3341 7509 (H)

Club meetings are on the first Tuesday of the month starting at 7.30PM. There is no Club meeting in January.

Vice President

Margaret Rae

3395 1838 (H)

Secretary

Sandra Thomas

3711 4134 (H)

Meeting are held at the Little King's Hall on the corner of Carl and O'Keefe Streets, Buranda. Entry is via the gate on Carl St.

Treasurer

John Hinton

3343 3724 (H)

Outings Officer

David Kenrick

3349 8238 (H)

Membership Officer

Frank Garland

3341 5207 (H)

There is parking within the grounds and in Carl Street. Tea/Coffee and cake/biscuits are provided after the meeting. A coin donation would be appreciated.

Editor

Richard Kolarski

3341 7509 (H)

Membership

Social Secretary

Traci Nudl

3890 8196 (H)

Probationary Membership

Training Officer

Stuart Mackay

3890 8196 (H)

A non-member automatically becomes a Probationary Member on his/her first walk after signing the waiver form. There is no fee payable to become a Probationary Member.

Other Voluntary Positions

However a Probationary Member must become an Ordinary Member on his/her second walk by filling out a Membership Form and paying the membership fee.

Supper Convenor

Mary Sherlock

3209 8514 (H)

BWQ Rep

Stuart Mackay

3890 8196 (H)

BWQ Rep

Richard Kolarski

3341 7509 (H)

Ordinary Membership A person may become an Ordinary Member by filling out and signing a Membership Form, having a proposer sign the form and handing the form with the membership fee to a committee member or walk leader. The proposer may be a friend (who is a member of the Club) of the applicant, the leader of the walk that the applicant is on, the Membership Officer at a Club meeting or if the Membership Officer is not available, one of the committee members. An Ordinary Member has the right to vote at an AGM or be elected to a committee position. A Probationary Member has neither of these rights.

Members of Another Bushwalking Club Members of another bushwalking club which is affiliated with Bushwalking Queensland Inc (or an interstate Federation) and who are covered by the same Insurance do not need to become a member of our Club to go on our walks. However Club members will have priority if there is a limit on numbers.

Equipment Officer

John Brunott

3209 9598 (H)

Campsite Monitors John Brunott

Ballows, Paddys Knob

Kerry de Clauzel

Throakban, Barney Gorge and Lower Portals

Ann Kemp

Spicers Peak (east & west)

Richard Kolarski

Running Creek Falls

Barbara Makepeace

Rat-a-tat, Spicers/Doubletop saddle Rum Jungle

John Shera

Panorama Point

John & Julie Shera

Mt Superbus & Rabbit Fence Jct Lower Panorama

Ken Walters

Mt May saddle & Paddy’s Plain

Cafe Capers Introducing a new addition to the Newsletter which will contain occasional reviews of outstanding coffee spots for after-walk refreshments. First to be presented is:

Club Equipment Compasses

Topo Maps

GPS's

The Shed Cafe

Emergency Lights

First Aid Kits

UHF Radios

Cnr Boonah-Rathdowney Road and Upper Logan Road, Rathdowney. Open to the public on weekends 9am to 4pm.

The above are for free use by members. Contact David at 3395 1838 or [email protected] PLBs with inbuilt GPS The Club has 5 PLBs with inbuilt GPS. The PLBs will be made available at each Club meeting and will need to be returned at the following Club meeting. Contact Richard on 3341 7509. Abseil Gear (ropes, harnesses, helmets, karabiners etc) There is a $5.00 charge for use of the Club rope and another $5.00 charge for use of harness and accessories by Ordinary Members. There is a $10.00 charge for use of the Club rope and another $10.00 charge for use of harness and accessories by Probationary Members and members of affiliated clubs. Contact Trevor at 0411 512 202 Back Pack for Hire

This is a good place to try out after a walk in the Barney/Maroon area. Patricia

Comings And Goings Patricia, Richard, Frank, Helen, Lynn, Ann and Noelene have recently been in Europe. They did a week's walking in the Pyrenees and a week's walking the Camino de Santiago in Spain.

Neil D has gone overseas for a week in Great Britain followed by a walk in Bulgaria.

$3.00 each or 2 for $5.00.

These bivy bags are 2 metres by 0.9 metres and are bright orange in colour. Use as a pack liner or emergency bivy bag. Contact Patricia Kolarski on 3341 7509. Space Blankets For Sale

Excellent coffee, including cappuccinos, and various cakes plus delicious olives and olive cold pressed olive oil available for sale.

John M. has recently done a trip to France where he did a walk in the Mt Blanc area.

$5.00 charge

Contact Trevor at 0411 512 202 Bivy Bags For Sale

Entry via the gate into the olive grove on Upper Logan Road. Follow the dirt road to the top of the hill and find “The Shed”.

Aileen is in New Guinea at the moment doing the Kokoda Track.

Members

$2.50 each.

Light weight and take up no room at all. A must for all walkers! Contact Patricia Kolarski on 3341 7509. Page 2 of 6

As at 1/6/2009 we have 102 financial members

Notices

The First Ten Years

From Dave Haliczer Dear fellow bushwalkers I realise that any walk associated with my name in some circles is associated with gruelling challenges, uncomfortable unplanned overnight epics and all types of unpleasant experiences. Having got this out of the way I have some extended hikes coming up which in my opinion are the complete opposite of challenging and so I ask that people consider these and realise that I have an expectation that you will find these relaxing and immensely enjoyable experiences.

This month we will look at that group of members that makes this a bushwalking club, the walk leaders. They are the backbone of the Club. Our Club is fortunate in having a wide range of people as walk leaders and so caters to all levels of experience. Some leaders are people who had never done any bushwalking till recently while others have brought with them a great deal of experience from other clubs such as leading walks, navigation or abseiling. The following statistics are taken from February 1999 to end December 2008.

Each of these walks are considered Australia's best coastal walks and my expectations for long distance walks are that they should be relaxing and not the intense experiences of a day walk.

LEADER

B/C D/W O/N T/W X/T Total

Richard Kolarski

11

97 69

1

2

72

Great Ocean Walk (Victoria)

Patricia Kolarski

7

51

8

4

70

4

33

8

1

46

Barbara Makepeace

11

29 June to 7 July

David Haliczer

2

24

7

Walk starts on the 30th leaving Melbourne at 9am. Arriving at Apollo Bay by 1pm we will walk 10km to the first campsite (Elliott Ridge). From here on the walk moves through the Otway Ranges and the beautiful beaches of the Shipwreck Coast to arrive on day 8 in view of the 12 Apostles.

Bob and Danuta Gur 11

23

Ken Walters

4

34

38

If you are interested you will need to make some bookings fast. I am hoping for some company but realise this is very short notice. No day is longer than 15km and the track is well maintained with awesome campsites with water and toilets so leave the trowel at home. There are lighthouses, beautiful beaches and I promise to be good company. http://www.greatoceanwalk.com.au/

David Kenrick

2

33

35

32

32

Cape to Cape (WA)

John Brunott

53

141

John Morris

22 September to 2 October

Considered by many the best time to see this area as the winter rains have eased, the winds are calmer and wildflowers which are more colourful than anywhere else I have been will be out. There will be no long days if we give ourselves 7- 8 days of walking. There are several beach side cafe's and kiosks along the way to reduce the food load a little. It will be good for swimming then as well.

45

Barry Ellerington

2

21

3

1

27

Steve Moyle

5

20

1

1

27

Linda Hellmuth

7

Maria Lanari

8 days of walking between these dates to allow for a day or two at Margaret River and a stop over in Perth. Actual walking dates should be 23rd September and finishing on 1st of October with room for a rest day in between.

53

19

26

24

24

Kerry de Clauzel

3

16

Trevor Davern

7

7

2

3

David Rae

10

5

2

Anne Kemp

16

16

13

14

14

14

Helen McAllister

1

Noelene McCay

1

Bill Butler

1

7

1

Ed Thistlethwaite

8

1

1

2

22

2

19 17

11 1

11

June Greenaway

11

Paul Makepeace

10

South West Cape Circuit (Tasmania)

Danuta Gur

10

10

9 January 2010 to 15 January

Jennifer Wallace

10

10

This will mark the third year in a row that I will have walked this circuit of the South West corner of Tasmania. The area is less well known than other sites in Australia but is the best undiscovered gem for bushwalkers.

Christine & Cliff Harrison

My first two trips were done in six days both with a rest day and this time it will happen in 7 days so there will definitely be at least one rest day and maybe two if people would prefer not to explore Spain Bay which is a half day walk from Noyheener beach.

Trevor Cox

9

Trevor Smith

5

A maximum of 4 - 5 people on these trips is possible as some camping sites may be a bit cramped with any more than 4 tents.

Michael Menzel

Please contact David Haliczer for further details on any of these walks. Ph No. 0432 901 030

Jenny Gwyer

6

6

Margie Rae

6

6

Michael Peel

6

6

John Hinton

5

5

Pilgrimage 2009

21-23 August 2009

This year's Pilgrimage will be at the Lake Maroon Holiday Park 535 Burnett Ck Rd., Maroon from Friday 21st to Sunday 23rd August. Registration Form in PDF format at http://www.bushwalkingqueensland.org.au/docos/RegistrationFo rm.pdf Registration Form in Word format at http://www.bushwalkingqueensland.org.au/docos/RegistrationFo rm.doc

1

4

Ken Fraser

2

Steve Hill

9

Julie Urquhart

5

Margaret Smith

8

Evelyn Campbell

1

11 1

11

3

1 7

9 9 9 9

2

1

1

2

1

9 8 8

7

7

5

6

Those who have led less than 5 walks are: Con Vink, Frank Bowling, Gill Gunthorpe, Jim O'Meara, Sandy Thomas, Stuart Mackay, Chris Breitenbach, Dean Workman, Fran Murdoch, Melanie Niblett, Suzanne Williams, Cathy Thistlethwaite, Drew O'Brien, Frank Garland, Janet Ellerington, Lindsay Anlezark, Lynne Cavanagh, Mal Rees, Nicole Waller, Shirley Ryan, Wayne Thompson, Gail Cibilic, Ian Finlay, Jenny Hogue, John Rosendale, Mary Sherlock , Neil Douglas, Paul McDonald and Traci Nudl.

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Past Walks Mt Matheson Walk

14 March 2009

Twelve of us met at Aratula on a warm overcast morning. We drove to Spicers Gap Picnic area and started our small gradual climb up to Mt Matheson along the recently maintained track. We continued along the track, having a shortened morning tea break due to some leeches and spotted a couple of snakes along the way to keep the day interesting. Clear views could be seen of Mt Mitchell and Mt Cordeaux. After passing the timber jinker we continued up to the lookout at Governors Chair where clear views could be seen around the Moogarah Dam area. A short stroll back to the picnic area for lunch completed this enjoyable half day walk. Many thanks to Helen for organising and leading the walk and thank you to my fellow walkers for your enjoyable company. Lynn

Mt Greville

21 March 2009

Club rules state a Club "walk" needs to have a minimum of 4 people so this event is classified as a pre-outing. A pre-outing can have fewer than 4 people but for safety's sake a PLB must be taken. However this walk is so good that I am including a write-up to encourage others to do it. The two of us drove down to Yellow Pinch on an overcast day which threatened rain. We walked the dirt road leading to South (Peasant's) Ridge where the long slog up the mountain began. To the saddle of Mt Barney is an ascent of about 800 metres. The track is quite good but there are a couple of rocky slabs and chutes to climb up. However by taking it easy and having frequent rest stops it was relatively easy. Along the way we only saw three other people going up the mountain for a day walk. We arrived at the saddle just after midday and set up camp where the old University hut used to be. This was an excellent spot for a camp as it was next to a stream and had great views down the mountain. We set up a lean-to for shelter in case of rain and had our lunch enjoying the views.

There were seven of us on this walk including one new member on his first walk with the club. We set off at the Mt Greville car park and headed uphill following the signs to Waterfall Gorge. It was a relief that we finally reached the start of the gorge due to hot humid conditions. In the gorge a stream of water was flowing. I now know why its called Waterfall Gorge. We ascended the gorge rock hopping between the narrow high vertical cliffs on either side. We stopped for morning tea along the way and watched water running over the sides of the steep cliffs into the gorge. Our progress was very slow due to slippery rocks and rock pools to negotiate. After two and a half hours, not joking, we exited the gorge and had a rest on a large rock slab which had views of Moogerah Dam and Fassifern Valley.

At West Peak

After some minor exploring round the camp site we decided to try West Peak which was about another 300 metres vertical up. We found a track which took us along an escarpment and before we knew it, we were at the summit cairn. This was a first for me as I had never been to West Peak.

Hold On to That View

We continued on walking uphill through overgrown vegetation around the side of the mountain until we met the main track to the summit. There we had lunch and admired the views. We descended via the main track and followed green painted dots down Palm Gorge. The gorge was very impressive with tall palms and large spiders the size of a hand hanging on webs. Although slippery we made good time back to the cars. Afternoon tea at Aratula was well earned. Many thanks to John, Ralph - new member, Gil, Marion, Aileen and Geraldine for a great day. Noelene

Mt Barney T/W Pre-outing

21 22 March

Julie has been doing a throughwalk to Mt Barney once a year over the last few years as it is a good way of finding out how your fitness is going plus having the benefit of doing a throughwalk on south-east Queensland's iconic mountain. In the past I have only done Mt Barney as a day walk and so I jumped at the chance to do this throughwalk. Unfortunately there was only the two of us which was a shame as it is a great walk.

Luckily that night it was fine with no rain. The next day we walked to East Peak and descended via South-East Ridge which was again a first for me as I had been up this ridge a couple of times but never down. The track was quite good but a bit exposed and required some scrambling. Along the way we had superb views of Logan Ridge. We were back at the car before lunch so we drove to Rathdowney where for $2.00 we had the biggest bag of chips which we were hardly able to finish. Many thanks to Julie for leading this walk and I would encourage everyone else to do this walk at least once in their lifetime. Richard

Love Creek Falls

29 March 2009

Eight walkers including myself assembled at Maiala picnic ground on a potentially rainy day to do the Love Creek Falls walk that has a little bit of everything, track walking, compass navigation, a waterfall, rock hopping and a steep climb out. A 5.5 kilometre drive up the road brought us to the turn off just below Tenison Woods Mountain and the start of the walk. A short distance past the locked gate an old logging track veers off to the right and we followed this for a couple of kilometres to its end and then followed a rough track to the top of a knoll past the turn off to the Piper Comanche wreck. We stopped there for a while for an early morning tea break and I was beginning to realise I could have started the walk about one hour later.

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From there it was a bit of compass work through rain forest until we had dropped down the hill enough to turn off onto a ridge that took us to the top of the falls. A bit of sloppy navigation on my part on the final descent to the creek had us about 80 metres to the left of where should have been but a quick correction back to the ridge brought us back on track and we continued down to come out about 100 metre from the top of the falls.

On Wilson's Peak

We had our lunch near the bottom of the mountain and then drove to Boonah where we tried out a new coffee shop. Many thanks to those who came along.

Long Barrabool Ridge Lunch on Love Creek

Having plenty of time up our sleeves we had a leisurely lunch break at the top of the falls and the was more water flowing over the falls than I had seen for a long time a number of the group took this opportunity to walk down to the bottom of the falls. After lunch we rock hopped up the creek for about 300 metres to where a substantial creek enters from the left and we exited Love Creek up the bank just past this entry. The climb out is initially fairly steep but this soon leads on to an obvious ridge which leads to a knoll just above the Mt. Glorious road. Just before we reached the top of the knoll the rain that the weather bureau had promised the day before arrived with a brief heavy shower but as we were in fairly thick rain forest we did not become very wet. The top of this ridge has some impossibly thick growth which forced us to take a bit of a detour around it before turning west to reach the road. From here it was about a 1 kilometre walk back along the road back to the cars. After the walk we pulled into a coffee shop set in the rain forest on the Mt. Glorious road that served the most gigantic cups of coffee I had ever seen which was the icing on the cake for all the coffee lovers in the group. Thanks to all the club members that participated. David Kenrick

Wilsons Peak

11 April 2009

Richard 18 April 2009

Long Barrabool Ridge was expected to be a day walk but became an unexpected overnight walk (the first time this has happened for me). Four of us left Brisbane at 5am and drove up to Cleared Ridge. We walked along the ridge towards the high point on the south of Upper Portals and descended along the track system to the campsite opposite Barney Gorge. From here we crossed the creek and ascended Midget Ridge. We didn't summit Bippoh until 11:30 am and even then I knew there would be some night walking but we were still ascending West Peak until 1pm when we had lunch. A traverse was made when it was clear that the lovely slabs that exist in this area allowed a traverse around to the ridge to Barrabool. The vegetation was very thick and this added to our time to get to Barrabool. At the saddle I ascended 5 minutes to get water from the top of Barrabool Creek. We then ascended over Barrabool and past the campsite where we picked up rubbish after people who probably camped up here over Easter. It was getting late in the afternoon and I should have decided on the shorter ridge but enjoyed the long ridge so much on a previous occasion that I led us down that way again. There are several interesting crags and caves to use when descending or ascending this ridge and it was great to see and use these again.

It was the day before Easter so I put on this walk going up and down Wilson's Peak from the western side. This is the shortest route up the mountain and would allow us to finish early. There were seven of us who met up at Boonah. There had been some rain in the previous days but I was prepared with an alternate walk should the weather turn bad. Luckily as we drove up to Teviot Gap the top of Wilson's Peak could be seen and it looked as if the rain might hold off. We parked the cars alongside the road and began the walk up but not before I slipped and fell on some slippery hard clay. Luckily only my pride was hurt. The track follows the border rabbit fence between Queensland and New South Wales. It initially is a road but then becomes a walking track as the terrain becomes increasingly steeper. We made steady progress up the mountain but there were no views till we were more than three-quarters up the mountain. We had morning tea on a grassy spot which had views below between the trees. The last section uphill was a scramble up a wet slippery cliff line. We all made it safely and finally gathered round the summit cairn. We had lunch at a viewpoint nearby. We retraced our steps back down and gave each other a hand down the last bit of cliff line. Everyone had gloves and we were able to hold onto the fence line as we made our way down the steep track. There were some minor falls but no injuries.

View of West Peak Behind Barrabool Peak

Near the base of Long Barrabool Ridge it was getting dark and we found a nice slabby descent off the ridge into the creek that led to some cliff initially but a way was found down in the dark into the creek. As only three of the four had a decent head lamp or torch, the going was slow and by 9pm we all came to the realisation that getting home this night was impossible. We decided to make for the Barrabool Camp site and slept (if you could call it sleep) under the stars without tent, sleeping bag or thermorest. The next day we had a slow rock hop up Barney Ck on account on how full of water it was and it took a good four hours to get back to the cars. It was an adventure and enough communication was made to people to prevent concerns arising from those closest to us. Dave Haliczer

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Venezuela Mount Roraima is the highest of a group of table-top mountains, known as tepuis, in the north-east region of South America. It has 400 metre cliffs on all sides and is the triple border point of Venezuela, Brazil and Guyana. The average height of the plateau is about 2,700 metres with the highest point, Maverick Rock, at 2,810 metres.

The track now was steep and slippery and after ascending another 400 metres we were at the cliff line. However the exertions were too much for Patricia and she was unable to continue any further up the mountain. The guide and I took Patricia's gear and we returned to Base Camp.

Despite the steep sides of the plateau which make it difficult to access, it was first climbed in 1884 along a forested ramp and this is the same route hikers use today. It is the only nontechnical route to the top as any other approach would involve climbing gear. It is thought that the reports from early Victorian expeditions to the mountain inspired Sir Arthur Conan Doyle to write his classic adventure novel, The Lost World, in 1912 - which has been made into countless films. Patricia and I did a trip to Brazil and Venezuela with one of our main objectives to climb this mountain. The starting point for this walk was Santa Elena de Uairen, a town in Venezuela but only a few kilometres from the Brazilian border. Here there are several backpacker hostels and you can hire guides and porters for a walk up to the Roraima plateau lasting usually 4-5 days.

Base Camp and the Ramp Leading up to the Plateau Mt Roraima and Paraitepui Village

From Santa Elena it is a 80 kilometre drive by 4WD vehicle to the native village of Paraitepui where there is a camping ground and the checkpoint for walkers. A 4WD is definitely needed as the last section is on dirt and uphill and the frequent rain made the roads slippery. Paraitepui is situated at 1,200 metres and has impressive views of Mt Roraima and several other tepuis. However they were frequently covered in cloud or obscured by rain. In fact on our 5 day trip it rained every day. We had porters for the walk but still needed to carry our own personal clothes and sleeping bag. Our first day was initially meant to be a walk down to the Kukenan River at 1,050 metres and then camp the night at Base Camp at 1,870 metres. However several delays meant that when we reached the river, the weather was closing in and it was unsafe to continue. Thus after crossing the thigh deep river we set up the tents for a wet night.

The next morning Patricia felt much better but had no inclination to climb the mountain. However the guide agreed to take me up to the plateau and back for the day while Patricia stayed behind. I was glad I did. Though it rained constantly during the day and it was quite cold on the plateau, it was a misty, mystic and surrealistic experience. Though from a distance there appeared no clear walk up the cliff wall, the forested ramp was quite wide with no exposed areas. At one section it was necessary to walk under a waterfall. When we reached the plateau it was covered in mist which made the strangely carved rocks even more spectacular.

The Flying Turtle

Beside the strange rock sculptures there was a myriad of unique plant life to be seen. The Valley of the Crystals was strewn with multiple white and pink quarts crystals. For me it was an experience like no other.

Patricia on way to Mt Roraima

After a few hours on the plateau trying to capture the magic of the area on camera in between the rain showers, I returned to Base Camp.

Thus the next day was to be to the top of the plateau, a vertical ascent of almost 1,800 metres. We reached Base Camp around morning tea and then set off for the ascent of Mt Roraima.

Patricia fully recovered from her exertions the day before and our walk out over the next couple of days was uneventful. Richard

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