Open Discussion
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ဆလိုင္း Aခ်င္းခ်င္း ခ်ေနႀကရံုန႕ဲ တိုင္းျပည္တိုးတက္ေျပာင္းလဲသြား မယ္ထင္ေနရင္ ခ်ႀကပါ၊ ေနာက္လာမယ္႕မ်ိဳးဆက္သစ္ေတြက ေနာင္ေတာ္ ၈၈ မ်ိဳးဆက္ေတြကို ေစာင္႕ႀကည္႕သင္ယူေနႀကတယ္၊ လက္ဆင္႕ကမ္းဘို႕ Aသင္႕ရွိေနႀကတယ္ဆိုတာကိုေတာ႕ မေမ႔ႀကေစခ်င္ပါဘူး။ တိုက္ပြဲလမ္းေႀကာင္း မေပ်ာက္ဘူးဆိုရင္ စစ္Aာဏာရွင္ ကို ဘယ္လိုျဖဳတ္ခ်ႀကမလဲဆိုတာ ေဆြးေႏြးေပးႀကဘို႕ မ်ိဳးဆက္သစ္ လူငယ္ေတြက ေတာင္းဆိုေနပါတယ္။ ေAာင္မ်ိဳးတင္႕ 2008/11/25 peter limbin Thanks, PLB
--- On Mon, 11/24/08, Salai KKO wrote: From: Salai KKO Subject: [8888peoplepower] Response to Dr Naing Aung To: "8888 People Power" <8888peoplepower@ yahoogroups. com> Date: Monday, November 24, 2008, 6:34 PM
--- On Mon, 11/24/08, Salai KKO wrote: From: Salai KKO Subject: Re: Politically Corrupt Lead Democratic Forces to Wrongful Polices To: "Naing Aung" , "88G Exiles" <88_generation_ students_ exile@yahoogroup s.com>, "Htun Gyaw" Date: Monday, November 24, 2008, 12:50 AM Naing Aung I never heard salaried revolution organization in Burmese history but now I'm seeing obviously. Everybody see and know how much money you make and how much you paid the staffs who follow your policies. If leading political organization heading to wrongful direction, we have a chance to comment or crying loud, in order to avoid of sinking in the tricky political mud. My current position is in grass root position and I understand what I should do in grass root position. Firstly, I can say to you, I've never made money or received money from NGO, and I do not want to take salary or eat or drink with this money because people were suffering
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everyday from wrongful policies of "Talking with the Generals instead of Peace Talk". How many years did you try for that policies? And show the audience what is the progress of its policies. Everybody know it's fruitless policies but money came throw to your account. When you guys share salaries money, did you hear people are crying in hungry. Why you guys scare to tell in donors meeting, talking policy will not work for Burma and people will be more suffering from its consequent. In order to make money making organization or secondary NGO, you guys intentionally left ABSDF and formed NDD. You couldn't erase these remarkable background history and evidentially showed up as salaried political employees. Donors and western NGO became as you guys boss or employers methodically. As a grass root guy, I always feel what is the painful state of people who lives under the brutal dictatorship. Most of politicians and activists sacrificed their livelihood and had longer jail terms, in order of to rescue the helpless people. After, SPDC killed monks and let Nargis victims dying in delta, TALKING POLICIES wouldn't anymore with SPDC. If you ignored this situation, and still holding talking strategy, you guys are automatically become big liars or activists under the shadow of NGO policies. I believed that they told you guys " If you get dollars from us, you guys must follow our policies." Can you deny it? If you guys were sincere in all this background, I had to say northing but now I must say openly because movements are getting into twenty years. WRONGFUL POLICIES CANNOT BE SUCCEED SALARIED ERASE SACRIFICED. If you guys accept yourselves as innocent politicians, please show sacrificing and do not forget who've already sacrificed in twenty years. This is my opinion. If you hate me, I love your hating because I wanted to see sincereness genuine sacrificing. Ko Ko Oo (Salai)
--- On Sun, 11/23/08, Naing Aung wrote: From: Naing Aung Subject: Re: Politically Corrupt Lead Democratic Forces to Wrongful Polices To: "Salai KKO" , "W Naing Oo Ashay Gyi" <win_naing64@ yahoo.com>, "88G Exiles" <88_generation_ students_ exile@yahoogroup s.com>, "kmt kmt" , "Aye Min" , "Win Min" <winmin@post. harvard.edu>, "myatsoe9872" <myatsoe9872@ yahoo.com>, "Nyo Ohn Myint" , "AAPP Org" , "Maung Soe" Date: Sunday, November 23, 2008, 9:12 PM Dear KK Oo, Can you tell me what are you doing in last 10 years? And I don't have time to have fight like in ABSDF time. Prove yourself and try to know the ground before you complain about others. Please don't look at superficial things. That is my honest request as I hate seeing as you all are terribly hopeless by reading all of your mails. Burma doesn't need complaints as they have enough. Burma needs people who works. And please remember that we all know who are and how you do. Please don't think that I wrote back to you because of your letter. I just feel bad that you are fighting among us when the time is needed to focus fighting on SPDC. I am sick of it. We all know NCGUB is weak and we all at the border organizations know why you are
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talking about NCGUB reform at this time now. So please also don't treat us as we are child. Also please don't hope that I will reply any of your letter. Naing Aung Secretary General Forum For Democracy in Burma Coordinator, Community Organizing Program Human Rights Education Institute of Burma Policy Board Member Network for Democracy and Development Phone: 66 81 883 7230 Email: dna_freeburma@ yahoo.com Skype: dnaforfreeburma
From: Salai KKO To: W Naing Oo Ashay Gyi <win_naing64@ yahoo.com>; 88G Exiles <88_generation_ students_ exile@yahoogroup s.com>; kmt kmt ; Aye Min ; Win Min <winmin@post. harvard.edu>; myatsoe9872 <myatsoe9872@ yahoo.com>; Nyo Ohn Myint ; Naing Aung ; AAPP Org ; Maung Soe Sent: Monday, November 24, 2008 6:41:13 AM Subject: Politically Corrupt Lead Democratic Forces to Wrongful Polices
After I read Ko Tun Aung Gyaw articles, I'd realized what is the painful state of us. So I released my impatience, and started to demand major political reform among democratic forces. Most of the Burmese democratic money making organizations( MMO), based on Washington, D.C. and Measot, have no rightful strategies, and are politically corrupt. They can only manage to beg the UN, crying for free Aung San Suu Kyi, and demanding for political prisoners because beneficially received share money from foreign NGO for their future salary. It's very shameful for democratic forces, and also major weakness of overthrowing the greatest Notorious regime of Burma. The base of armed revolution regions, Measot became a popular city of Burmese self-promoted Non Government Organizations that now named as money making organizations (MMO). Even true red revolution minded young man can easily change into salaried employees of MMO. Now our closet enemy is policy corruption among us. They do not worry much about people who were suffering from wrongful policies but salaries are major goals of easy-going leaders of MMO. If we couldn't drive them to proper way, they carelessly and shamelessly continue to make profit on current political situations. Finally, I asked everybody who loves sincereness, please step up and crying political reform now. Here are nine points of major requests * Stop making profit from political process. * Please registered MMO to NGO. * Declare yourselves as salaried officials and staffs * Stay away from all Burmese strategies meeting or policies meeting.
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* Stay away from Measot, if you respect people who've being fighting in the jungle * If you can't sacrifice your benefit, transform yourselves to ordinary people or businessman * Do not consider MMO as your business * Please confessed to the people of your failing policies in twenty years * Finally, please contribute your professionalism to help people voluntarily To whom it may concern..... Dr Sein Win and NCGUB members Dr Thaung Tun and UN teams Dr Naing Aung and NDD members Dr Zaw Oo Dr Zarni U Han Nyaung Shwe (Son of S. Shwe Thike) Kyaw Kyaw (PD) Maung Maung ( FTUB) Bo Kyi and ( AAPP) Aung Naing Oo Aung Htoo (BLC) Some other individual followers
Posted by Ko Ko Oo ( Salai) Nov 23rd, 2008
__._,_.___ Ok... You know....the problem with People from BURMA is, If who ever come up and dare to speak out what he / she see things, they never look at the fact that why he / she brought up that issue , but by replying,, why don't you come down and do it by yourself. That is the problem of People from Burma , including SPDC 's Generals. I still don't know and still waiting to see meaningful response from main actors . If KoKo Oo's accusation is faulse and groundless, why don't those main actors come out and clear it, for instance, whether or not he / she is receiving salaries and how much beig paid and how much their policies are affective towards bringing Burma Freedom. I don't care how much they are pocketing as long as their ploicies are affective. KoKo Oo did not say everyone working at the border are bad and if you are clear in your concious just keep quite and listen, or, have a gut to speak out againt those oppotunists rather than keep smiling infront of them when someone got gut to do so. As one has said in this reply, he agreed that there are some opportunists well paid activists, so why dosen't he speak it out, and just forgiving for God sake of Unity ? That is what they call critical thinking. I myself being as a grassroot sine at the begining of the 88 and receiving no salaries but never miss an action whenever needed. Talking about surcrifice.. ? if I tell you , you gonna cry for weeks, but I just keep doing with a spirit of NEVER GIVE UP. I know there are something really wrong with well paid activists and their policies but, don't know where to cry out. I want to hear from those people who are in policies making position. I wash dishes to get money to pay for travelling to the fxxxxxking embassy, to the fxxxxxxking
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gathering, to pay fxxxxking internet fee, to make some fxxxxking donation and I am in a fxxxxking Thind County and not having Fxxxxking Luxsuy life My Leaders have been prisoned for fxxxking 65 years. I am fxxxxxking frustrated. Am I being rude ..???? Fxxk Off !!!
-- On Sat, 29/11/08, Nyo Myint wrote: From: Nyo Myint Subject: RE: [8888peoplepower] to Ko Nyo Ohn Myint-Crying for Policies Reform To: "8888 peoplepower" <8888peoplepower@ yahoogroups. com> Date: Saturday, 29 November, 2008, 6:18 PM Dear Ko Ko Oo,
I may not think that my reply has correct answer for you but I tried my best to share my views here. I do not want to be a center of the internet war since I have to cover A to Z things here and unable to read all of comments from different compatriots.
But I do share my personal view which may not reflect my political organization and my affiliations. I do agree what you said as seen on political theater. But we got to look at root causes and fair minded to judge what the final outcome is until day. Something they have been doing would not be disclosed in terms of package agreement.
I fear our movement may lose momentum of the pressure mechanism since our braved Buddhist monks created after 2010. But we must have a pressure and forget about hopeful dialogue from exile. Our responsibility is to get more pressure and how to create a pressure mechanism for inside our colleagues.
But when you create or build a pressure, few activists may lose their permanent seats for longtime, we may see casualty of war, and this has to pay the price. Fair to say, this resistance has seen everywhere. Waiting for Daw Aung San Suu Kyi would be free and do something might not be fit current situation. In terms of finding a solution to free her, Ko Min Ko Naing and 88 generation leaders, ethnic leaders, we have to establish the pressure on select targets. Regime knows well about preemptive mechanism but we have much alternative pressure against them to set our leaders free.
I have no comment why not doing by Dr Sein Win since I have worked on Credentials Challenges on behalf of NCUB. Perhaps, the opponents of CC would accuse me that I play a political game of creation alliance with others. But sadly, we missed the huge pressure mechanism without preemptive measure from regime. I felt that when we tried to hit the regime face and someone took our stick away. This is what I could tell you at this time. At lease, DASSK and all of our leaders should deserve any strong pressure from outside.
On the other hand, we can't blame movement alone, regime's severe pressure is also part of the movement is being standstill. Our political activists' job is to create alternative route to reach our goal. We can't say because of regime, because of leadership crisis. We have to stand on our own foots. My personal feeling is we discussed
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the future grand strategy, many input, some have emotion, but none implement and failed to follow up what we agreed upon.
My experience has educated me; using soft tone but firm your principles, and never lose your focus. Others would use their own judgment; I have no idea and sincerely don't know Ko Ko Oo. One of my assessments is comprehensive approach and division of labor is quite important and speedy sharing the results of your approach within is a key to the accomplishment.
Hope you doing well and I might not have time to reply you these days, because we'd have three days brain storming international coordinating meeting ☺ at border with different players.
Best, Nyo Ohn Myint
To: 8888peoplepower@ yahoogroups. com From: kko102@yahoo. com Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2008 08:05:34 -0800 Subject: RE: [8888peoplepower] to Ko Nyo Ohn Myint-Crying for Policies Reform Ko Nyo Ohn Myint I welcome to most of judgement come from you but all of us need to be showing virtually. Why I said those today, so-called leaders don’t unveil efficacy and effectiveness at all. Most of the activists haven’t had a great efficiency and speed of current policies, and doing implementation with other organization, Even an activist put forward a realistically acceptable policy, but all these guys blocked that proposal and kicking out this activist and rumors out as a foolish or childish person. All these guys’ policies are depending on financial assistance and their future. For example, why Dr Sein Win denied to sign for "Credential challenge," or why Naing Aung and Thaung Tun stand by Dr Sein Win. It’s clearly revealed their opportunistic infection on Burma issues. How can we keep our mouth shut and ignore their behaviors? Please think about and replace yourself in dictatorship position for a moment, what you can do and how can deal with these incapacities or weakness of us. It’s very easy to halt our movements. First, use a few million’s dollars and hire a several guys as NGO staffs. Then, make restrictions on policies will harm dictatorship and give financial assistance for so-called leaders. The junta can be saved, peaceful, enjoyable entire lives, if they apply to cost several million dollars. In this point, what’s more important when Burma needs’ international policies change "policies toward Burma." Should we reduce or bargain our polices and keep current
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activities level moving? Or should we asked more effective or aggressive actions from international or the UN or any government who support Burma freedom. If we couldn’t make a correct choice from time to time, movement will be delayed on longer and longer. People will be suffering longer and longer, from ineffective policies toward Burma. Why we lacked a consensus grand strategy among democratic activists? If we’re trying to make leverage or making the regime becoming a weaker, the constructively softer policy likely a useless tool to overthrow the great notorious regime. If we stand on constructively softer policies, international stand on that policies too. Is that their misjudgment or our mistakes? Dr Thaung Tun is consistently bearing "the constructively softer policies" to the UN. The outcome of policies will make movement weaker and weaker in daily basic. He’s one of the weakest leaders who can speak English better than most activists. If we put a person who can fluently speak with groundless and petitionary policies, the pay price will be higher and higher for suffering people. All the activists living in safely placed, must be sympathizing on painful people, and to develop fresh and effective policies those can be leveraged the regime. If we’re not feeling that way and continue to exercise easy-going policies, we wouldn’t be seen democracy in the rest of our lives. Ko Ko Oo --- On Fri, 11/28/08, Nyo Myint wrote: From: Nyo Myint Subject: RE: [8888peoplepower] to Ko Nyo Ohn Myint-Crying for Policies Reform To: "8888 peoplepower" <8888peoplepower@ yahoogroups. com> Date: Friday, November 28, 2008, 1:15 AM Dear Ko Ko Oo,
First of all, I am not mad at you and any defensive feeling at all. As we chatted in Ft Wayne sometime last year and I said, we should struggle within movement and that should have solution to improve and able to transform into real pressure on regime.
I have no objection or any negative view towards your frustration, but I wanted to correct your points into action, nothing more. I never try to silent your opinion. Do you think that I am favoring the wrong doers? I like Maungmingyithar' s one point, he doesn't care about any corruption, but he cares about efficacy and effectiveness. I don't know macro management but my intention is how to pressure against regime and how to make leverage while regime becomes weaker.
We missed to transform the Saffron Revolution to more political space but regime's retaliation is harder than before. When you looked at the opportunity but you weren't able to drive to the right direction, how do you feel?
I think you read my points differently, division of labor is more important if grand strategy was right. Do we have strategy to coordinate between so-called leader and grassroots? We should take this opportunity and able to conduct or facilitate better off. Let me clear you, I never consider I am one of the leader or so-called leaders, I
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am just an activist who wanted to contribute my energy for the country.
Answer to your question, I do not have a time to investigate BIG BOSS's situation, but I am sure I have struggled how to make a visa run and how to pay traveling cost (bus, motorcycle taxi, etc…) in job relating matters. You may ask your neighbors what is my situation.
Sadly, we missed so many political opportunities in terms of lack of fund. Defending principles and struggling with funders. in fact, politics is not buying and selling products, so you can't say how much you can provide the results. This is why untold stories still exist; just do what you could do.
If you need to fix it, you have to consider different. Realistically speaking; having a shotgun and shooting from miles away, effectiveness might be minimal.
Unity should be built on the trust and cooperation issue by issue, and then you may know whom should be working with and how to handle the issues.
Best, Nyo Ohn Myint
To: 8888peoplepower@ yahoogroups. com From: kko102@yahoo. com Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2008 21:02:32 -0800 Subject: RE: [8888peoplepower] to Ko Nyo Ohn Myint-Crying for Policies Reform Ko Nyo Ohn Myint My opinion and target are heading to only corrupt or easy-going persons. If you feel you’re not in there, you shouldn’t be mad on comments came from grassroots activists. Things need to be fixed on time, should be fixed on time. Behaviors need to be fixed on time, should be fixed on time. If a person or group, didn’t care and fix their behavior or failed to correct on time, judgements will come from all direction. Before you said "accuse blanket accusation," please rethinking about 20 years’ activities. Grassroots activists have been tolerating socalled today leaders. You couldn’t make me silence in this way. If so-called today leaders fixed their behaviors and showing signs of passionate and progressive manners, all critics will be silenced automatically. And also, all grassroots will be backing on them again. If so-called leaders considered on grassroots as worthless for them, they can do as they like but the pay price will be higher and higher. I really understand what is the unity. Is friendly unity? Is forgiveness unity? Smiling or greeting each other is unity? It’s northing. Only rightful policies can build a genuine unity among us. If you can explain to me, I have a question for you about the BIG BOSS. Do you know how much salary BIG BOSSES take and how much they pay to Small Boss or little staff? Why did they exercise or introduce money politic? Why some BIG BOSSES are so rich? If you are a poor person who’s coming to Thailand and
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working hard for poor families, how do you feel when you see their wealthiness. Can you forgive them? Or mad? In Buddhism, forgiveness is good nature for absolving who made a mistake accidentally. If someone intentionally makes evil, spoil or corrupt, they have to pay the price in present life. Finally, a question for all of us is, Why "A few good men," are so popular in political environment? I’d really respect to "A few good men," and who’re working hard in the borderline. DO NOT BUILD UNITY ON FORGIVENESS WRONGFUL POLICIES CANNOT BE SUCCEEDED SALARIED ERASE SACRIFICED. DON’T SELL OURS BELIEVES TO THE NGO DON’T FEED talking strategy TO SUFFERING PEOPLE. TALKING SHOW WILL BE MADE GIFT Ko Ko Oo (Salai)
--- On Tue, 11/25/08, Nyo Myint wrote: From: Nyo Myint Subject: RE: [8888peoplepower] to Mai Bhone Kyaw-Crying for Policies Reform To: "8888 peoplepower" <8888peoplepower@ yahoogroups. com> Date: Tuesday, November 25, 2008, 9:05 PM Dear Ko Ko Oo,
I am sorry to interrupt you. Indeed, all of our compatriots love our country and all wanted to see SPDC/military dominancy must be gone. But things are not what we expected; a long and bitter battle, using different strategies and tactics as much as we can. We have sprit of freedom lovers and one day we will win in our mind.
You can't accuse blanket accusation that most of the borderline is corrupted, this is not true. Everywhere you go, you might see different correctors and attitudes. Only thing, if you want to correct it, you have to involve deeply and correct it. We can't come here for one length of tourist visa or a year, you have to invest long time to correct it, you all come from 8888, became leaders around here two decades ago, this area is not a new ground, you all gone through. Things have changed. No Thai friends favored like 1988, you have to go cleverly.
You may not say lack of efficiency at the border, both has to be blamed if you want to, severe repressions, geopolitical conditions; uphill battle with neighboring countries. Indeed, lack of collective approach and misunderstanding and personal argument are center of our movement.
Borderline or settle in third country, as long as your intention is sincere and mature enough, I
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don't think there would have any major argument or disagreement. I agreed with Mai Phone Kyaw one point; borderline is not a park or vacation center. Pressures we face and space we have to create.
We can't demonstrate before the Burmese embassy, this is what BKK folks would do it, but you do, at least you and others may take young generation to the mayor office or local congress and showed solidarity.
Personally, I sometimes sick and tired of border living condition, you have to struggle to pay office rent to personal living. We hate to struggle with donors while defending your principles, you may not say I quit, because organization that to depend some funds from them. So you can't say much, but to smile.
Thus, most of our colleagues choose to migrate to third country through resettlement program. Simple consideration, they thought west and recipient countries are better for the border; this is why they are leaving from border. Just handful comes back and works. One more thing; we have no future, no 401K plan and no benefits at all Ko Ko Oo, you know more than I do. But we all have a life, should not be discriminated.
Due respect among each other, we should welcome critical thinking, but blanket accusation might not be nice. Weaknesses and mistakes within 20 years could be told but never end. But think about it; we should have how to fix it, you got to pay the price, nothing is free. When I came back, I just wanted to contribute for the movement here. Border is not beautiful if you stay longer and longer.
We have to face these evils while our leaders from USA and other countries hit behind us, benefits will go to the regime, not me or you, no doubt.
Thank you, Nyo Ohn Myint
To: 8888peoplepower@ yahoogroups. com From: kko102@yahoo. com Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2008 15:02:15 -0800
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Subject: Re: [8888peoplepower] to Mai Bhone Kyaw-Crying for Policies Reform Phone Kyaw
As you know, borderline and oversea, just only difference is geography but I’m sure that there’s no fighting like us. Borderline is now like a non revolution area but all guys out there just can do like you do. Sometime borderline can do more than oversea and sometime oversea can do more than borderline. I do not think most borderline guys are still believing Burma needs revolution because their behavior and action showing up. I let you know, policies fighting and not personnel. If they do change their easy-going, salaried employees’ system, and Boss and staffs relationship, I will continue to disclose my opinion. An enemy can be a friend, and a friend can be your enemy in anytime in anyway. Easy-going, money making, secondary NGO policies will never be work for Burma freedom. I’m sure, and it’s another 20 years. When we came to borderline in 1988, there’s no rich man among the activists, now you can see or hear about some rich activists. It’s shaped our movement obviously. If you feel some policy’s maker betray the people, you may be silenced. If you silenced, you’ll be lacking of protecting our movements. Don’t be silenced *** I’m fully respect who working hard and fighting hard in the borderline.
--- On Mon, 11/24/08, phonekyaw wrote: From: phonekyaw Subject: Re: [8888peoplepower] to Mai Bhone Kyaw-Crying for Policies Reform To: 8888peoplepower@ yahoogroups. com Date: Monday, November 24, 2008, 6:24 PM ကုိUီး က်ေနာ္လည္းပါ၀င္ ေဆြးေႏြးခြင့္ျပဳပါ။ မိမိလုိခ်င္တဲ့Aရာကုိ Aင္တာနက္ေပၚမွာ ေတာင္းဆုိတာ ေဆြးေႏြးတာထက္စာရင္ နယ္စပ္မွာ Aားလုံးျပန္ဆုံေတြ႔ျပန္လုပ္တာက ပုိေကာင္းမယ္ထင္ပါတယ္။ ႏုိ႔မုိ႔ဆုိ တတိယႏုိင္ငံေတြက လူေတြက ဆရာလုပ္ေနတယ္လုိ႔ ထင္Aုံးမယ္။ Aေကာင္းဆုံးကေတာ့ Aားလုံးဆင္းလုပ္ၾကရင္ ပုိေကာင္းမယ္။ လုပ္ခ်င္တဲ့သူေပါ့။ သတိရလွ်က္
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ဘုန္းေက်ာ္ (လူ႔ေဘာင္သစ္)
--- On Mon, 11/24/08, shwe htee <shwehtee@yahoo. com> wrote: From: shwe htee <shwehtee@yahoo. com> Subject: Re: [8888peoplepower] to Mai Bhone Kyaw-Crying for Policies Reform To: 8888peoplepower@ yahoogroups. com Date: Monday, November 24, 2008, 4:43 PM
Hi Ko Ko Oo, I love to work for or support the real groups who are working hard for Burma. Not the opportunists. I don't want to see the people of Burma suffer any more. We can fight againist wrong and unnecessary policies for Burma. Shwe Htee (8888) From: Salai KKO To: 8888peoplepower@ yahoogroups. com Sent: Monday, November 24, 2008 3:24:05 PM Subject: [8888peoplepower] to Mai Bhone Kyaw-Crying for Policies Reform Mai Bhone Kyaw Palaung Youth
I fully respect who really working hard in borderline or oversea. Especially, borderline should be freed from easy-going individual or organization because these situations can shade the whole democratic movements. Practicing or introducing salaried political employees and staffs, will destroyed sacrificed minded and produced more opportunists. I do not want see more opportunists in stead of freedom fighters. I always fully support and respect freedom fighters; on the other hand I hate opportunists. I just only categorized and divided between freedom fighters and opportunists. If we want to win we must to fight closet enemies first. Now the closet enemies are wrongful policies for us. If you see someone leading or carrying this wrongful policy, we must stop them first. If they do care or listen to you, you must challenge and fight their policies head to head. It's called responsible to protect our movements.
Thanks Ko Ko Oo (Salai)
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--- On Sun, 11/23/08, Mai Tea wrote: From: Mai Tea Subject: Re: [8888peoplepower] Crying for Policies Reform To: 8888peoplepower@ yahoogroups. com Cc: "88G Exiles" <88_generation_ students_ exile@yahoogroup s.com>, "Ko Htun Aung Gyaw" , "Htun Gyaw" , "BBC Media" , "RFA Media" , "DVB Media" , "Aye Min" , "myatsoe9872" <myatsoe9872@ yahoo.com> Date: Sunday, November 23, 2008, 11:38 PM Dear Salai KKO, We all are suffering the same painful. I understand what is your feeling on current political movement. But I would like to beg you and every body that be constructive way to correct our movement. There are a lot of MMO in Maesot, Chiang Mai, US, EU and everywhere, as you mentioned. However, there are a lot of people who really sacrifice their lives for our country in MS, CM, EU, US not only in the jungle. Especially there are a lot of people who based in Maesot are committed their lives and have strong works to help inside activities or even themselves taking risk to cross the border and doing UG. Including me and some people who staying in Maesot have a commitment to our movement and never consider about third countries and luxury life. Anyway let's us correct our movement to be strong and working together to topple military regime. Apologize for being reply with poor english. Best regards, Mai Bhone Kyaw Palaung Youth 2008/11/23 Salai KKO After I read Ko Tun Aung Gyaw article, I'd realized what are the painful of us. So I released my patience and start to demand major political reform among democratic forces. Most of the Burmese democratic money making organizations, based on Washington, D.C. and Measot, have no rightful strategies and politically corrupt. They can only manage to beg the UN, crying for free Aung San Suu Kyi, and demanding for political prisoners because beneficially received share money from foreign NGO for their future salary. It's very shameful for democratic forces and major weakness of to overthrow the greatest Notorious regime of Burma. The base of armed revolution regions, Measot became a popular city of Burmese self-promoted Non Government Organizations that now named as money making organizations (MMO). Even true red revolution minded young man can easily change into salaried employees of MMO. Now our closet enemy is policy corruption among us. They do
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not worry much about people were suffering from wrongful policies but salaries are major goals of easy-going leaders of MMO. If we couldn't drive them to proper way, they carelessly and shamelessly continue to make profit on current political situations. Finally, I asked everybody who loves sincereness, please step up and crying political reform now. Here are nine points of major requests * Stop making profit from political process. * Please registered MMO to NGO. * Declare yourselves as salaried officials and staffs * Stay away from all Burmese strategies meeting or policies meeting. * Stay away from Measot, if you respect people who've being fighting in the jungle * If you can't sacrifice your benefit, transform yourselves to ordinary people or businessman * Do not consider politically MMO as your business * Please confessed to the people of your failing policies in twenty years * Finally, please contribute your professionalism to help people voluntarily
To whom it may concern..... Dr Sein Win and NCGUB members Dr Thaung Tun and UN teams Dr Naing Aung and NDD members Dr Zaw Oo Dr Zarni U Han Nyaung Shwe (Son of S. Shwe Thike) Kyaw Kyaw (PD) Maung Maung ( FTUB) Bo Kyi and ( AAPP) Aung Naing Oo Aung Htoo (BLC) Some other individual followers
Ko Ko Oo ( Salai) 88 GSE ** I urge everybody should shows what is your painful and opinion clearly. I attached Ko Tun Aung Gyaw article to read.
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--- On Mon, 11/24/08, Salai KKO
--- On Mon, 11/24/08, Salai KKO
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everyday from wrongful policies of "Talking with the Generals instead of Peace Talk". How many years did you try for that policies? And show the audience what is the progress of its policies. Everybody know it's fruitless policies but money came throw to your account. When you guys share salaries money, did you hear people are crying in hungry. Why you guys scare to tell in donors meeting, talking policy will not work for Burma and people will be more suffering from its consequent. In order to make money making organization or secondary NGO, you guys intentionally left ABSDF and formed NDD. You couldn't erase these remarkable background history and evidentially showed up as salaried political employees. Donors and western NGO became as you guys boss or employers methodically. As a grass root guy, I always feel what is the painful state of people who lives under the brutal dictatorship. Most of politicians and activists sacrificed their livelihood and had longer jail terms, in order of to rescue the helpless people. After, SPDC killed monks and let Nargis victims dying in delta, TALKING POLICIES wouldn't anymore with SPDC. If you ignored this situation, and still holding talking strategy, you guys are automatically become big liars or activists under the shadow of NGO policies. I believed that they told you guys " If you get dollars from us, you guys must follow our policies." Can you deny it? If you guys were sincere in all this background, I had to say northing but now I must say openly because movements are getting into twenty years. WRONGFUL POLICIES CANNOT BE SUCCEED SALARIED ERASE SACRIFICED. If you guys accept yourselves as innocent politicians, please show sacrificing and do not forget who've already sacrificed in twenty years. This is my opinion. If you hate me, I love your hating because I wanted to see sincereness genuine sacrificing. Ko Ko Oo (Salai)
--- On Sun, 11/23/08, Naing Aung
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talking about NCGUB reform at this time now. So please also don't treat us as we are child. Also please don't hope that I will reply any of your letter. Naing Aung Secretary General Forum For Democracy in Burma Coordinator, Community Organizing Program Human Rights Education Institute of Burma Policy Board Member Network for Democracy and Development Phone: 66 81 883 7230 Email: dna_freeburma@ yahoo.com Skype: dnaforfreeburma
From: Salai KKO
After I read Ko Tun Aung Gyaw articles, I'd realized what is the painful state of us. So I released my impatience, and started to demand major political reform among democratic forces. Most of the Burmese democratic money making organizations( MMO), based on Washington, D.C. and Measot, have no rightful strategies, and are politically corrupt. They can only manage to beg the UN, crying for free Aung San Suu Kyi, and demanding for political prisoners because beneficially received share money from foreign NGO for their future salary. It's very shameful for democratic forces, and also major weakness of overthrowing the greatest Notorious regime of Burma. The base of armed revolution regions, Measot became a popular city of Burmese self-promoted Non Government Organizations that now named as money making organizations (MMO). Even true red revolution minded young man can easily change into salaried employees of MMO. Now our closet enemy is policy corruption among us. They do not worry much about people who were suffering from wrongful policies but salaries are major goals of easy-going leaders of MMO. If we couldn't drive them to proper way, they carelessly and shamelessly continue to make profit on current political situations. Finally, I asked everybody who loves sincereness, please step up and crying political reform now. Here are nine points of major requests * Stop making profit from political process. * Please registered MMO to NGO. * Declare yourselves as salaried officials and staffs * Stay away from all Burmese strategies meeting or policies meeting.
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* Stay away from Measot, if you respect people who've being fighting in the jungle * If you can't sacrifice your benefit, transform yourselves to ordinary people or businessman * Do not consider MMO as your business * Please confessed to the people of your failing policies in twenty years * Finally, please contribute your professionalism to help people voluntarily To whom it may concern..... Dr Sein Win and NCGUB members Dr Thaung Tun and UN teams Dr Naing Aung and NDD members Dr Zaw Oo Dr Zarni U Han Nyaung Shwe (Son of S. Shwe Thike) Kyaw Kyaw (PD) Maung Maung ( FTUB) Bo Kyi and ( AAPP) Aung Naing Oo Aung Htoo (BLC) Some other individual followers
Posted by Ko Ko Oo ( Salai) Nov 23rd, 2008
__._,_.___ Ok... You know....the problem with People from BURMA is, If who ever come up and dare to speak out what he / she see things, they never look at the fact that why he / she brought up that issue , but by replying,, why don't you come down and do it by yourself. That is the problem of People from Burma , including SPDC 's Generals. I still don't know and still waiting to see meaningful response from main actors . If KoKo Oo's accusation is faulse and groundless, why don't those main actors come out and clear it, for instance, whether or not he / she is receiving salaries and how much beig paid and how much their policies are affective towards bringing Burma Freedom. I don't care how much they are pocketing as long as their ploicies are affective. KoKo Oo did not say everyone working at the border are bad and if you are clear in your concious just keep quite and listen, or, have a gut to speak out againt those oppotunists rather than keep smiling infront of them when someone got gut to do so. As one has said in this reply, he agreed that there are some opportunists well paid activists, so why dosen't he speak it out, and just forgiving for God sake of Unity ? That is what they call critical thinking. I myself being as a grassroot sine at the begining of the 88 and receiving no salaries but never miss an action whenever needed. Talking about surcrifice.. ? if I tell you , you gonna cry for weeks, but I just keep doing with a spirit of NEVER GIVE UP. I know there are something really wrong with well paid activists and their policies but, don't know where to cry out. I want to hear from those people who are in policies making position. I wash dishes to get money to pay for travelling to the fxxxxxking embassy, to the fxxxxxxking
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gathering, to pay fxxxxking internet fee, to make some fxxxxking donation and I am in a fxxxxking Thind County and not having Fxxxxking Luxsuy life My Leaders have been prisoned for fxxxking 65 years. I am fxxxxxking frustrated. Am I being rude ..???? Fxxk Off !!!
-- On Sat, 29/11/08, Nyo Myint
I may not think that my reply has correct answer for you but I tried my best to share my views here. I do not want to be a center of the internet war since I have to cover A to Z things here and unable to read all of comments from different compatriots.
But I do share my personal view which may not reflect my political organization and my affiliations. I do agree what you said as seen on political theater. But we got to look at root causes and fair minded to judge what the final outcome is until day. Something they have been doing would not be disclosed in terms of package agreement.
I fear our movement may lose momentum of the pressure mechanism since our braved Buddhist monks created after 2010. But we must have a pressure and forget about hopeful dialogue from exile. Our responsibility is to get more pressure and how to create a pressure mechanism for inside our colleagues.
But when you create or build a pressure, few activists may lose their permanent seats for longtime, we may see casualty of war, and this has to pay the price. Fair to say, this resistance has seen everywhere. Waiting for Daw Aung San Suu Kyi would be free and do something might not be fit current situation. In terms of finding a solution to free her, Ko Min Ko Naing and 88 generation leaders, ethnic leaders, we have to establish the pressure on select targets. Regime knows well about preemptive mechanism but we have much alternative pressure against them to set our leaders free.
I have no comment why not doing by Dr Sein Win since I have worked on Credentials Challenges on behalf of NCUB. Perhaps, the opponents of CC would accuse me that I play a political game of creation alliance with others. But sadly, we missed the huge pressure mechanism without preemptive measure from regime. I felt that when we tried to hit the regime face and someone took our stick away. This is what I could tell you at this time. At lease, DASSK and all of our leaders should deserve any strong pressure from outside.
On the other hand, we can't blame movement alone, regime's severe pressure is also part of the movement is being standstill. Our political activists' job is to create alternative route to reach our goal. We can't say because of regime, because of leadership crisis. We have to stand on our own foots. My personal feeling is we discussed
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the future grand strategy, many input, some have emotion, but none implement and failed to follow up what we agreed upon.
My experience has educated me; using soft tone but firm your principles, and never lose your focus. Others would use their own judgment; I have no idea and sincerely don't know Ko Ko Oo. One of my assessments is comprehensive approach and division of labor is quite important and speedy sharing the results of your approach within is a key to the accomplishment.
Hope you doing well and I might not have time to reply you these days, because we'd have three days brain storming international coordinating meeting ☺ at border with different players.
Best, Nyo Ohn Myint
To: 8888peoplepower@ yahoogroups. com From: kko102@yahoo. com Date: Fri, 28 Nov 2008 08:05:34 -0800 Subject: RE: [8888peoplepower] to Ko Nyo Ohn Myint-Crying for Policies Reform Ko Nyo Ohn Myint I welcome to most of judgement come from you but all of us need to be showing virtually. Why I said those today, so-called leaders don’t unveil efficacy and effectiveness at all. Most of the activists haven’t had a great efficiency and speed of current policies, and doing implementation with other organization, Even an activist put forward a realistically acceptable policy, but all these guys blocked that proposal and kicking out this activist and rumors out as a foolish or childish person. All these guys’ policies are depending on financial assistance and their future. For example, why Dr Sein Win denied to sign for "Credential challenge," or why Naing Aung and Thaung Tun stand by Dr Sein Win. It’s clearly revealed their opportunistic infection on Burma issues. How can we keep our mouth shut and ignore their behaviors? Please think about and replace yourself in dictatorship position for a moment, what you can do and how can deal with these incapacities or weakness of us. It’s very easy to halt our movements. First, use a few million’s dollars and hire a several guys as NGO staffs. Then, make restrictions on policies will harm dictatorship and give financial assistance for so-called leaders. The junta can be saved, peaceful, enjoyable entire lives, if they apply to cost several million dollars. In this point, what’s more important when Burma needs’ international policies change "policies toward Burma." Should we reduce or bargain our polices and keep current
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activities level moving? Or should we asked more effective or aggressive actions from international or the UN or any government who support Burma freedom. If we couldn’t make a correct choice from time to time, movement will be delayed on longer and longer. People will be suffering longer and longer, from ineffective policies toward Burma. Why we lacked a consensus grand strategy among democratic activists? If we’re trying to make leverage or making the regime becoming a weaker, the constructively softer policy likely a useless tool to overthrow the great notorious regime. If we stand on constructively softer policies, international stand on that policies too. Is that their misjudgment or our mistakes? Dr Thaung Tun is consistently bearing "the constructively softer policies" to the UN. The outcome of policies will make movement weaker and weaker in daily basic. He’s one of the weakest leaders who can speak English better than most activists. If we put a person who can fluently speak with groundless and petitionary policies, the pay price will be higher and higher for suffering people. All the activists living in safely placed, must be sympathizing on painful people, and to develop fresh and effective policies those can be leveraged the regime. If we’re not feeling that way and continue to exercise easy-going policies, we wouldn’t be seen democracy in the rest of our lives. Ko Ko Oo --- On Fri, 11/28/08, Nyo Myint
First of all, I am not mad at you and any defensive feeling at all. As we chatted in Ft Wayne sometime last year and I said, we should struggle within movement and that should have solution to improve and able to transform into real pressure on regime.
I have no objection or any negative view towards your frustration, but I wanted to correct your points into action, nothing more. I never try to silent your opinion. Do you think that I am favoring the wrong doers? I like Maungmingyithar' s one point, he doesn't care about any corruption, but he cares about efficacy and effectiveness. I don't know macro management but my intention is how to pressure against regime and how to make leverage while regime becomes weaker.
We missed to transform the Saffron Revolution to more political space but regime's retaliation is harder than before. When you looked at the opportunity but you weren't able to drive to the right direction, how do you feel?
I think you read my points differently, division of labor is more important if grand strategy was right. Do we have strategy to coordinate between so-called leader and grassroots? We should take this opportunity and able to conduct or facilitate better off. Let me clear you, I never consider I am one of the leader or so-called leaders, I
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am just an activist who wanted to contribute my energy for the country.
Answer to your question, I do not have a time to investigate BIG BOSS's situation, but I am sure I have struggled how to make a visa run and how to pay traveling cost (bus, motorcycle taxi, etc…) in job relating matters. You may ask your neighbors what is my situation.
Sadly, we missed so many political opportunities in terms of lack of fund. Defending principles and struggling with funders. in fact, politics is not buying and selling products, so you can't say how much you can provide the results. This is why untold stories still exist; just do what you could do.
If you need to fix it, you have to consider different. Realistically speaking; having a shotgun and shooting from miles away, effectiveness might be minimal.
Unity should be built on the trust and cooperation issue by issue, and then you may know whom should be working with and how to handle the issues.
Best, Nyo Ohn Myint
To: 8888peoplepower@ yahoogroups. com From: kko102@yahoo. com Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2008 21:02:32 -0800 Subject: RE: [8888peoplepower] to Ko Nyo Ohn Myint-Crying for Policies Reform Ko Nyo Ohn Myint My opinion and target are heading to only corrupt or easy-going persons. If you feel you’re not in there, you shouldn’t be mad on comments came from grassroots activists. Things need to be fixed on time, should be fixed on time. Behaviors need to be fixed on time, should be fixed on time. If a person or group, didn’t care and fix their behavior or failed to correct on time, judgements will come from all direction. Before you said "accuse blanket accusation," please rethinking about 20 years’ activities. Grassroots activists have been tolerating socalled today leaders. You couldn’t make me silence in this way. If so-called today leaders fixed their behaviors and showing signs of passionate and progressive manners, all critics will be silenced automatically. And also, all grassroots will be backing on them again. If so-called leaders considered on grassroots as worthless for them, they can do as they like but the pay price will be higher and higher. I really understand what is the unity. Is friendly unity? Is forgiveness unity? Smiling or greeting each other is unity? It’s northing. Only rightful policies can build a genuine unity among us. If you can explain to me, I have a question for you about the BIG BOSS. Do you know how much salary BIG BOSSES take and how much they pay to Small Boss or little staff? Why did they exercise or introduce money politic? Why some BIG BOSSES are so rich? If you are a poor person who’s coming to Thailand and
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working hard for poor families, how do you feel when you see their wealthiness. Can you forgive them? Or mad? In Buddhism, forgiveness is good nature for absolving who made a mistake accidentally. If someone intentionally makes evil, spoil or corrupt, they have to pay the price in present life. Finally, a question for all of us is, Why "A few good men," are so popular in political environment? I’d really respect to "A few good men," and who’re working hard in the borderline. DO NOT BUILD UNITY ON FORGIVENESS WRONGFUL POLICIES CANNOT BE SUCCEEDED SALARIED ERASE SACRIFICED. DON’T SELL OURS BELIEVES TO THE NGO DON’T FEED talking strategy TO SUFFERING PEOPLE. TALKING SHOW WILL BE MADE GIFT Ko Ko Oo (Salai)
--- On Tue, 11/25/08, Nyo Myint
I am sorry to interrupt you. Indeed, all of our compatriots love our country and all wanted to see SPDC/military dominancy must be gone. But things are not what we expected; a long and bitter battle, using different strategies and tactics as much as we can. We have sprit of freedom lovers and one day we will win in our mind.
You can't accuse blanket accusation that most of the borderline is corrupted, this is not true. Everywhere you go, you might see different correctors and attitudes. Only thing, if you want to correct it, you have to involve deeply and correct it. We can't come here for one length of tourist visa or a year, you have to invest long time to correct it, you all come from 8888, became leaders around here two decades ago, this area is not a new ground, you all gone through. Things have changed. No Thai friends favored like 1988, you have to go cleverly.
You may not say lack of efficiency at the border, both has to be blamed if you want to, severe repressions, geopolitical conditions; uphill battle with neighboring countries. Indeed, lack of collective approach and misunderstanding and personal argument are center of our movement.
Borderline or settle in third country, as long as your intention is sincere and mature enough, I
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don't think there would have any major argument or disagreement. I agreed with Mai Phone Kyaw one point; borderline is not a park or vacation center. Pressures we face and space we have to create.
We can't demonstrate before the Burmese embassy, this is what BKK folks would do it, but you do, at least you and others may take young generation to the mayor office or local congress and showed solidarity.
Personally, I sometimes sick and tired of border living condition, you have to struggle to pay office rent to personal living. We hate to struggle with donors while defending your principles, you may not say I quit, because organization that to depend some funds from them. So you can't say much, but to smile.
Thus, most of our colleagues choose to migrate to third country through resettlement program. Simple consideration, they thought west and recipient countries are better for the border; this is why they are leaving from border. Just handful comes back and works. One more thing; we have no future, no 401K plan and no benefits at all Ko Ko Oo, you know more than I do. But we all have a life, should not be discriminated.
Due respect among each other, we should welcome critical thinking, but blanket accusation might not be nice. Weaknesses and mistakes within 20 years could be told but never end. But think about it; we should have how to fix it, you got to pay the price, nothing is free. When I came back, I just wanted to contribute for the movement here. Border is not beautiful if you stay longer and longer.
We have to face these evils while our leaders from USA and other countries hit behind us, benefits will go to the regime, not me or you, no doubt.
Thank you, Nyo Ohn Myint
To: 8888peoplepower@ yahoogroups. com From: kko102@yahoo. com Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2008 15:02:15 -0800
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Subject: Re: [8888peoplepower] to Mai Bhone Kyaw-Crying for Policies Reform Phone Kyaw
As you know, borderline and oversea, just only difference is geography but I’m sure that there’s no fighting like us. Borderline is now like a non revolution area but all guys out there just can do like you do. Sometime borderline can do more than oversea and sometime oversea can do more than borderline. I do not think most borderline guys are still believing Burma needs revolution because their behavior and action showing up. I let you know, policies fighting and not personnel. If they do change their easy-going, salaried employees’ system, and Boss and staffs relationship, I will continue to disclose my opinion. An enemy can be a friend, and a friend can be your enemy in anytime in anyway. Easy-going, money making, secondary NGO policies will never be work for Burma freedom. I’m sure, and it’s another 20 years. When we came to borderline in 1988, there’s no rich man among the activists, now you can see or hear about some rich activists. It’s shaped our movement obviously. If you feel some policy’s maker betray the people, you may be silenced. If you silenced, you’ll be lacking of protecting our movements. Don’t be silenced *** I’m fully respect who working hard and fighting hard in the borderline.
--- On Mon, 11/24/08, phonekyaw
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ဘုန္းေက်ာ္ (လူ႔ေဘာင္သစ္)
--- On Mon, 11/24/08, shwe htee <shwehtee@yahoo. com> wrote: From: shwe htee <shwehtee@yahoo. com> Subject: Re: [8888peoplepower] to Mai Bhone Kyaw-Crying for Policies Reform To: 8888peoplepower@ yahoogroups. com Date: Monday, November 24, 2008, 4:43 PM
Hi Ko Ko Oo, I love to work for or support the real groups who are working hard for Burma. Not the opportunists. I don't want to see the people of Burma suffer any more. We can fight againist wrong and unnecessary policies for Burma. Shwe Htee (8888) From: Salai KKO
I fully respect who really working hard in borderline or oversea. Especially, borderline should be freed from easy-going individual or organization because these situations can shade the whole democratic movements. Practicing or introducing salaried political employees and staffs, will destroyed sacrificed minded and produced more opportunists. I do not want see more opportunists in stead of freedom fighters. I always fully support and respect freedom fighters; on the other hand I hate opportunists. I just only categorized and divided between freedom fighters and opportunists. If we want to win we must to fight closet enemies first. Now the closet enemies are wrongful policies for us. If you see someone leading or carrying this wrongful policy, we must stop them first. If they do care or listen to you, you must challenge and fight their policies head to head. It's called responsible to protect our movements.
Thanks Ko Ko Oo (Salai)
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--- On Sun, 11/23/08, Mai Tea
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not worry much about people were suffering from wrongful policies but salaries are major goals of easy-going leaders of MMO. If we couldn't drive them to proper way, they carelessly and shamelessly continue to make profit on current political situations. Finally, I asked everybody who loves sincereness, please step up and crying political reform now. Here are nine points of major requests * Stop making profit from political process. * Please registered MMO to NGO. * Declare yourselves as salaried officials and staffs * Stay away from all Burmese strategies meeting or policies meeting. * Stay away from Measot, if you respect people who've being fighting in the jungle * If you can't sacrifice your benefit, transform yourselves to ordinary people or businessman * Do not consider politically MMO as your business * Please confessed to the people of your failing policies in twenty years * Finally, please contribute your professionalism to help people voluntarily
To whom it may concern..... Dr Sein Win and NCGUB members Dr Thaung Tun and UN teams Dr Naing Aung and NDD members Dr Zaw Oo Dr Zarni U Han Nyaung Shwe (Son of S. Shwe Thike) Kyaw Kyaw (PD) Maung Maung ( FTUB) Bo Kyi and ( AAPP) Aung Naing Oo Aung Htoo (BLC) Some other individual followers
Ko Ko Oo ( Salai) 88 GSE ** I urge everybody should shows what is your painful and opinion clearly. I attached Ko Tun Aung Gyaw article to read.
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